Douglas Lucas Interview Transcript re Barrett Brown #FreeBB

Hey y’all I’m Scott Horton, this is my show the Scott Horton Show. Douglas Lucas from and he writes at, is that right? Welcome, how are you doing Douglas?

SH:, I didn’t get a chance to look, is that where you write?

DL: That’s my email address, I’m a freelancer and I writer for, dailydot ….lots of different places

SH: Okay, yeah I know Christian Stork over there.

DL: Yeah, yeah, he’s great

SH: Okay good deal, and he’s great on this particular issue too, a good segue here. Now, Barrett Brown, you have been attending his federal court sentencing today in Dallas Texas, is that correct?

DL: Right, we just got out for the lunch recess and we’ll be going back in in less than an hour

SH: We don’t know what he’ll be sentenced to but we do that he’s no longer face 100 years correct.

DL: Right he’s no longer facing 105 years or the 70 years that he was facing a little later in the case, he’s facing up to 8-5 years as the result of a plea deal that he took.

SH: He took the plea deal in order to let his mom off the hook because they were going to prosecute his mother, correct?

DL: No, that’s not correct, they prosecuted his mother earlier in the case, she got off with a misdemeanor and a fine of $1000 and 6 months probation.

SH: Oh i thought that was part of [his] deal thanks for clearing that up for me.

DL: The prosecution of his mother really did play a role in infuriating him, the fact that they searched her house in March of 2012.

SH: That was the event that got him in trouble, that made him go on youtube and threaten to dox the FBI agent right?

DL: Partially, he was also just fed up with the FBI not returning his gear – it was the raid by the FBI on his apartment and his mothers home in March of 2012.

SH: I’m sorry, its been a little while. So the point being he is facing 8.5 years, he pled guilty to what charges?

DL: He pled guilty to 3 counts. One was transmitting a threat, basically threatening the FBI agent – the one who was testifying today (Robert Smith) he will continue to be on the stand probably after the lunch break, that was up to 5 years.

He pled guilty to accessory after the fact and unauthorized access of a computer — up to 2.5 years and he plead guilty to a misdemeanor of interference with the execution of a search warrant — up to 1 year. The first two counts were felonies.

SH: Unauthorized access that was in regards to what? For copying and pasting the link?

DL: No, those counts were dropped following a really good defense motion to dismiss that indictment and The Electronic Frontier Foundation was about to submit a brief arguing against it and the prosecution gave up and dropped those counts.

SH: What unauthorized access did he plead guilty to?

DL: He himself did not access anything unauthorized, it’s accessory after the fact. The one who committed the unauthorized access was Jeremy Hammond, and that’s his access of the private intelligence firm Stratfor down in Austin. He hacked that organization in December 2011 as an FBI informant named Sabu watched on. So that all happened with the FBI’s knowledge, they apparently sacrificed Stratfor, let Stratfor go down, in order to whatever … I mean there are multiple theories. One is that they were trying to entrap Wikileaks by selling the emails… or something, there are multiple theories.

SH: As far as the FBI agents testimony today, what did he talk about?

DL: The prosecution asked him to talk about a whole bunch of exhibits that the prosecution just entered into evidence this morning. It was the first time the defense had seen this material — about 500 pages that was delivered to the defense this morning. So the defense tried to object to it, all or most of it, saying that it was not relevant but the prosecution was saying that these chat logs and emails – these interview quotes are relevant conduct to Barrett Browns sentencing because they show his role in anonymous as a strategist, or some sort of leader, as a person who was pointing toward what sort of places should be targeted, so they’re trying to paint — there are many points where Brown arguably sort of gets in some sort of accessory type vibe, but it’s difficult to say because journalists are always going to be talking with their sources and a lot of his communications are being really, in the exhibits, are being misunderstood by the Government — to say you know I have some quotes here — actually one of the examples was, “Does he says he is an anarchist, in exhibit number whatever?” and the FBI agent would say “Yes he does.”

The defense did object at that point saying how is that relevant? You know it is prejudicial but the judge said well this isn’t a jury trial I’m not intending to consider it in my sentencing but let’s just keep this show on the road. So it is really kind of strange that, you know here it is.

SH: I just wanna go back, sorry we are very short on time.

DL: Yeah.

SH: I just want to go over what you said because it is extremely important for people to understand, for a journalist to work his source to get more information is not a crime in the United States of America — sorry to whoever wants to spin it otherwise.

DL: It’s a grey area, but it should not be a crime. There is soliciting for classified material which can be considered a crime, but this is BS though. It is where they can, Brown said in one of the exhibits “We’re the most effective process to smash the institutions that need smashing.” Well that is, the FBI agent was like yeah he said that.

But that’s, y’know smashing institutions that need smashing is metaphorical, that is a general statement and the prosecution is trying to say that he is like a ringleader. At one point the prosecution even filed a motion that said Brown and anonymous plotted to overthrow the government.

SL: Well I’m actually a little heartened to hear that the prosecution is so desperate in invoking this stuff, I hope that the judge sees that ‘wow this is really all you guys’ve got?’

Alright we will all keep our fingers crossed thanks Douglas for the coverage I appreciate it.