Sorry I'm late.
I had to stop by the Wax Museum again and give the finger to FDR.
We know Al-Qaeda.
Zawahiri is supporting the opposition in Syria.
Are we supporting Al-Qaeda in Syria?
It's a proud day for America and by God we've kicked Vietnam syndrome once and for all.
Thank you very, very much.
I say it, I say it again.
You've been had.
You've been took.
You've been who's win?
These witnesses are trying to simply deny things that just about everybody else accepts as fact.
He came, he saw, he died.
We ain't killing they army, but we killing them.
We be on CNN like Say Our Name been saying, say it three times.
The meeting of the largest armies in the history of the world.
Then there's going to be an invasion.
All right, you guys.
Introducing the great Doug Bandow from the Cato Institute and a regular writer at The National Interest.
And he's got a few interesting ones here.
Well done.
You write so much all over the place.
The American Conservative and yeah, Forbes, I guess, lots of things.
Welcome back to the show, Doug.
How are you?
Happy to be on.
Doing okay.
Good.
So you have all these great articles about Turkey and Korea and all that.
Maybe we could transition into Turkey in a minute.
But first of all, there's this huge Washington Post story today about how, first of all, they're saying they're drawing a line.
They want the, not just for the Russians and Assad to be careful or something, but to call off the attack on the Idlib province, which is just commencing, as I gather, right now.
And also that they will keep the military, the US military, which I guess mostly means the Marine Corps, embedded with the Syrian defense forces, as they call them, the YPG Kurds and their allies in northeastern Syria.
And they'll stay there forever until or until Iran is gone, whichever comes first.
So what's your take?
Well, it's completely nutty.
I mean, you know, the point is, I was just over there for about a week wandering around, you know, Damascus, Homs, Aleppo.
I mean, you know, it's a tragic situation.
But the reality is the government's won.
You know, so the notion that they're going to stop and not take Idlib, because, you know, somebody in Washington mouthed something is simply crazy.
The point is, unless the US is willing to actually go to war to prevent it, you know, they're going to move ahead.
And, you know, this should not surprise us.
The point is, after seven years, they've been cleaning up.
It's a real tragedy.
But, you know, we should have no illusions there.
And the idea of keeping US troops there, I mean, it's utterly inane.
You wonder, in essence, you know, President Trump has turned into President Clinton.
You know, the idea that we're going to, you know, unconstitutionally, illegally, invade another country, dismember it, and demand that they can't have a relationship with another government.
I mean, the Iranians, you know, I don't like Iran, but the Iranians are invited by the government of Syria.
We weren't invited.
We just showed up, and Congress never voted on it.
And the notion that the Iranians are going to leave is another fantasy.
Why would they?
I mean, you know, and the reality is they have more interest than we do.
Why are we, you know, there?
That's the question we should be asking.
Yeah.
Well, and you know what, this goes along with the big scandal of the week, which usually the important news that we talk about doesn't.
But in this case, this letter to the New York Times, where specifically on foreign policy, never mind what the president says, we, the staff, do what we want anyway, and they specifically cite Russia.
And that does go to Syria policy, too.
You know, in January, Trump said, hey, when we're done with ISIS, then we're leaving.
And then Rex Tillerson, a couple of days later, basically said, belay that order.
That's just false.
We're here for Iran and Russia and Hezbollah and Assad, ultimately, and we're not leaving until he gets what we want on everything.
And, you know, I don't know if that was part of what got him fired, but it seems to be that the Defense Department and the CIA and whichever factions of whichever agencies have won here, and the president is helpless at their feet.
Well, you know, but he's helpless only because he doesn't fire them.
I mean, this is the problem.
You know, at the end, I mean, there's some issues where he's decided to push ahead.
He doesn't care what they say.
This is one of these.
He needs to walk into one of those meetings and say, I've had it.
This is the, you know, this is the law.
The troops come home.
Let's do it.
You know, and that's the problems.
I mean, it's an extraordinary affront to democracy.
I mean, I'm not a fan of Donald Trump, but the man was elected, elected by the people of America.
So the notion that some anonymous, you know, kind of appointed, you know, group of officials get to decide on policy over the elected officials is actually a very dangerous thing.
And we certainly see that in policies like this, which make no sense for America.
I mean, these are kind of nation building, you know, kind of, you know, trying to social engineering stuff around the world.
You know, it's not in America's interest, the interest of kind of an elite who like to run these policies.
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Well, and you're certainly right about that, but he doesn't know who else to hire because he doesn't read stuff.
So does he even know there's a skeptics blog at the National Interest?
No, he doesn't even know that there's, you know, at least one solid good handful of reluctant foreign policy types in DC that he could bring up because we know that he has at least semi-good instincts on Afghanistan and Syria for two examples, bad on a lot of other stuff.
But then he, you know, repeatedly, he just doesn't get his way on this.
He gives into them anyway, because he doesn't know where else to turn.
That's right.
He needs to have some people around him who will actually pursue his policies.
He doesn't.
He's surrounded by people who have their own agendas, and their agenda is to thwart him at every turn.
You know, and that, unfortunately, doesn't turn out well, you know, what comes down to the policies.
Well, you know, when they say, well, the guy's a nut, I mean, that part is really plausible.
But then you look at all the ways they want to hem him in.
And it's like, we have got to continue provoking Russia over made up accusations, completely unproven claims, more and always, and that this is his worst deficiency in power is wherever he's reluctant to punish Putin.
Well, the problem is that, you know, the people who say he's a nut, of course, advocate policies themselves that are crazy policies.
I mean, that was John McCain.
I mean, you know, the Capitol gave him this very warm farewell.
I mean, this is a man, you know, if you follow his policies, thousands of Americans have died, hundreds of thousands of foreigners have died.
You would think somebody would point that out and say, okay, maybe he's not the same kind of personality as the president.
On the other hand, look at his policies.
They've been a catastrophe.
So maybe somebody should at least mention that, you know, as opposed to kind of venerate him as a secular saint.
You know, when it comes down to it, who's the better president?
Well, frankly, Trump's better than McCain, because McCain would have us in so many other wars.
Yeah.
Hey, if McCain had won in a way, we'd all be dead by now.
I mean, it's horrifying to think about what wars we'd be in.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, now, so there is one specific example where Trump is determined to have his way and for the better, and for quite a bit better, and that is North Korea.
And there's a hell of a lot of naysaying going on, and I guess some reason for it.
But what do you think is, what's your position on, I guess, the current state of things there with the talks?
Well, I mean, the president deserves credit for trying to break the deadlock.
I think the challenge is, I believe the president had unrealistic expectations.
I think he appeared to believe that, you know, he'd show up at the summit and that Kim Jong-un would hand over all of his nukes, which, of course, would be stupid.
I mean, the point is Kim is not a dumb person.
He's seen what the U.S. has done in cases, you know, like Libya.
But I do think that the president's opened things up.
So my hope is that he'll be realistic and realize this is a step-by-step process.
The critical thing is we're moving in the right direction.
Last year, we were talking about nuclear war.
Now we're talking about how to try to move forward on denuclearization.
You know, I don't expect at the end of the day that the North will give up all of its nukes, but I think they'll make concessions if we make concessions.
I mean, we have to, this is a step-by-step, and that's far to the better compared to where we were, and frankly, where we were under President Obama or Bush.
And now on the details, sorry to put you on the spot, but just how much progress has been made in terms of the North Koreans stopping doing things and dismantling some things?
Because it's really, you know, Trump is such a big personality, and the USA, for that matter, is such a big player that it almost necessarily diminishes the role of really the leadership being taken here by the government of South Korea.
And they really have made some substantial progress, right?
Well, I think what's critically happening there is it looks to me like the South is determined to exert control over the process, and that's all to the better.
The South has a lot more at stake.
The South wants to have an overall relationship.
The South recognizes there are issues other than nuclear weapons, and they have a very real incentive to make sure everything ends up in a peaceful direction.
So moving the South to the forefront, I think, has been one of the very positive aspects of what's been going on.
It makes it much more likely that we'll have a positive outcome.
All right.
Now, real quick at the end here, tell me about Recep Erdogan.
Did I say his first name right?
Erdogan these days.
Tayyip Recep Erdogan, yeah.
He's a nasty guy.
I mean, this is kind of into the Sultan.
I mean, bad on human rights, moving in a more Islamic direction, more pro-Russian direction.
My reaction is we should simply say, you know, we don't have to be allied with this guy.
We should pull our nukes out.
Certainly, we have a bunch of nukes at Incirlik Air Base.
I think that's very stupid.
We shouldn't want them over there.
And frankly, we should be pulling our troops out.
The Turks hate us.
I mean, it's one of the most anti-American countries.
If you look at the popular attitudes, and we're just over there stirring things up, he's using anti-Americanism for his own political purposes.
We should say, fine, you go to it and we'll pull out.
We don't need him.
I mean, we're their superpower.
Washington acts as if we need him badly.
Actually, you know, the Turks need the U.S. far more than the U.S. needs Turkey.
Yeah.
Well, there you have it, folks.
America's shadow national security advisor, Doug Bandow at CATO, the guy who should be running the White House national security staff right now, but who's not.
Oh, I wish.
Yeah.
You sure do write a lot of great articles.
And you know, that bio still has worked for Ronald Reagan in it there, man.
So one of these days, Doug.
I'm going to keep it in.
Yeah.
I'm looking forward to you ending all the war someday.
I think it's going to have to be you, man.
I'll do my best.
Make those steps.
All right, everybody.
That is the great Doug Bandow.
Thanks, Doug.
Sure thing.
Take care now.
Bye-bye.
All right.
So CATO.org for him, of course, home base, but also writes for Forbes and the National Interest and the American Conservative Magazine as well.
And he writes like five times a week or something.
It's ridiculous.
And he knows everything about everything, as you can tell.
So check him out, the great Doug Bandow.
All right, y'all.
Thanks.
Find me at libertarianinstitute.org, at scotthorton.org, antiwar.com and reddit.com slash Scott Horton Show.
Oh, yeah.
And read my book, Fool's Errand, Timed and the War in Afghanistan at foolserrand.us.
