All right, y'all, welcome to the Scott Horton Show.
I am the Director of the Libertarian Institute, Editorial Director of Antiwar.com, author of the book Fool's Errand, Time to End the War in Afghanistan, and I've recorded more than 5,000 interviews going back to 2003, all of which are available at scotthorton.org.
You can also sign up for the podcast feed.
The full archive is also available at youtube.com slash Scott Horton Show.
Yay, on the line, I've got the great Phil Weiss from mondoweiss.net, which is one of my very favorite websites in the world and which has recently been redone to look even nicer than before.
Welcome back to the show.
How are you doing, sir?
Great.
Thanks, Scott.
Thanks for having me.
Very happy to have you here.
Great show.
So, listen, well, you're a great part of what makes the show great.
Hey, so it says here Biden is the most pro-Israel nominee ever.
And you must mean among the Democrats because Donald Trump is the sitting most Zionist man in the history of the world, I think, and he's already in the chair.
So tell me about Joe Biden, who's been in the Congress since 1972, and his record on Israel.
His record is just very, very strong on Israel.
I mean, in terms of supporting whatever Israel wants, that's he's demonstrated that again and again.
I mean, as he said, give a message to Bibi.
I love him.
I might disagree with him, but I love him.
And I think that the qualifier there is one that Biden has always had and that he has like when he was in the Obama administration as vice president, you know, he did say we find these settlements to be unhelpful.
We don't agree with these settlements.
And he will say that very mildly.
We don't agree with these settlements, but we love you.
So it's basically it's a almost unqualified endorsement.
And right now, Biden is doing his utmost to say there's no qualification whatsoever.
I will not be like President Obama, whom I served.
Anything Israel wants, it can do.
I will never condition aid to Israel.
We give nearly four billion a year to Israel.
The United States does.
I will never question that that money.
So it's a pretty craven record.
I don't think it's as bad as it's not as bad as what Trump has done.
Joe Biden is for restoring the Iran deal, which is a great thing, in my view and in the world's view.
And he would take he would not have moved the embassy to Jerusalem and sure he would not reverse.
He won't reverse that disastrous policy.
But just the same, he's right now, Biden is not going to be out Israel by the Republican Party.
They do not want this as a wedge issue in this campaign.
They can have a lot of other wedge issues or they'll they'll take on other progressive causes.
But any criticism of Israel off limits.
And it really is because they're afraid of losing donors and maybe some voters in Florida, to be clear.
Yeah.
All right.
So, I mean, there's so many different directions to go right there.
But let's start with the JCPOA.
This is the single best thing that Barack Obama ever did.
And of course, Trump ruined it for no good reason whatsoever.
Well, I think he did it for a very good reason.
Well, OK.
Touche.
So, I mean, that really raises the question of whether Biden would truly go back to it.
And, you know, the Ayatollah might say, hey, it's not that easy.
You're going to have to give me another concession or two.
And do we expect that Biden is going to do what it takes to restore the JCPOA when there's one and only interest group in the world trying to stop it?
And that's the government of Israel.
Yeah.
I guess I would say that I think that he will make an effort to restore the JCPOA.
And I think that the reason he would do so is that it is, as you say, you know, the greatest achievement of the Obama administration in foreign policy and truly a measure that advances world peace.
I mean, this is, you know, it cools off so much of the tension in the Middle East when you sort of nullify or reduce this this conflict between Iran and Israel, this this regional power struggle and all of Europe's behind it, Russia, China, everyone's for this deal.
And so this is a case in which it is, as you say, just one country is against it.
And these liberal Zionist groups that love Israel, you know, they will say again and again, well, all these security officials in Israel are for this agreement, retired and and security officials.
So I think that that's one where the weight of there's so much going for that deal politically that that Biden would be able to restore it.
It's a little bit like Israel seeking to annex lands in the West Bank officially, officially install apartheid this summer.
And it didn't do it.
And it didn't do it because it did not have the support it needed, I think, ultimately.
And even the Trump administration was going wobbly on that one.
But there are things that Israel will do.
And Biden was against it.
Biden said, I'm against annexation, not that he would condition aid over it, but it does show that there are some things where Israel's will can be defied.
Except going back to 2015, Netanyahu fought so hard to try to stop that thing.
Right.
And Obama, in fact, and we talked about this at the time, Obama was very frank and came out and said, you know what?
I heard what the prime minister's had to say.
And yet I'm the president of the United States of America.
I couldn't see Biden having the balls to do that, to stand up to Netanyahu like that.
OK, I mean, you might be right.
I mean, I think that and I mean, you know, if it wasn't Netanyahu, if it was just Brand X prime minister up there, maybe.
But I could just see Netanyahu saying, no way, I'm not going to stand for this.
Why should I?
And and why should he?
You know, I you know, you got a point.
I mean, I take your point.
And you're recalling one of Obama's great moments when he said it would be an abrogation of my constitutional duty if I did this for the state of Israel.
You know, basically, I mean, he did use the words abrogation, but he said, yeah, there's only one country in the world that's against this.
And then he said, I think it's in Israel's interest.
So, you know, the reason that these people have this power is because the Israel lobby.
And and let's be clear about that.
I mean, here here you have I mean, this is staggering, but here you have Chuck Schumer voting against Barack Obama on the most important thing he's done is in his administration and foreign policy.
And there are no consequences.
You know, the Democratic Party doesn't say, oh, screw you, Chuck Schumer, you voted against our president on the most important thing.
You're never going to be as you can never aspire to leadership.
No.
He becomes minority leader in the Senate.
So that's that's what the price you pay if you side with the Israel lobby.
Your career advances and it transcends American politics.
And you know, by the way, and I should mention this more often, I guess, when I interview you that when I introduce you on the show, that before you created Mondoweiss dot net and decided that this was really your issue, you were a hard news reporter for many years for The New York Observer and for I don't know who all.
And so when you talk about, hey, there's this Israel lobby and it does these things.
This isn't just a polemicist talking.
This is a man who really knows the story here.
You know, I don't want to put on air, Scott, because I think it matters because I can sit here and complain about the Israel lobby, but I couldn't claim to know about it the way that you can claim to know about.
OK, well, that that may be the case.
But the reason is I've devoted myself to reporting on this question for the last 15 years.
Yeah.
And after I got spat out by the mainstream media, but also to that point, I lost two jobs to the Israel lobby.
Jared Kushner fired me in 2007 at The Observer because I was reporting on apartheid on the West Bank.
And then a year and a half later, I'm out at the Nation Institute, a good progressive institution in New York, because, you know, this website is considered, I don't know, too critical of Israel or it's anti-Semitic or whatever charges made.
And so those charges have traction inside the Democratic Party, inside the blue states, inside the, you know, good progressive circles in in the blue states that where there are no evangelical Christians to be seen.
So this is a Democratic Party problem in addition to being Republican Party problem.
But it's distinctly Democratic when you talk about the Israel lobby's influence.
And now the Nation Institute, is that how separate is that from The Nation magazine?
Because Vanden Heuvel wouldn't have fired you, would she?
No, I don't think Katrina would.
She's a friend.
It has certain connections, you know, to The Nation magazine.
Can you say who it was that fired you there?
It was a guy named, who showed me the door, was a guy named Andy Breslin, Breslau, Andy Breslau, no longer there.
But I'd been brought in by Ham Fish and then was shown the door by Andy, you know, a year and a half later.
It was just too uncomfortable.
And I think that that would no longer be the case on the left.
But I think the left is getting a little bit more, is becoming more radicalized on this question.
And so that, let's just go to politics here for a moment.
There are very strong, the polling is very clear that large pluralities of Democratic Party voters support conditioning aid to Israel.
I mean, I think it's something like, you know, 50 percent of Democratic voters say they'd be for conditioning aid to Israel because, or cutting aid because of its unending settlement project.
And, you know, 15 percent of Democratic voters are against or something like that.
So it's an it's an overwhelming plurality.
And yet our politicians at the highest level cannot, in the Democratic Party, cannot reflect that sentiment.
They're afraid to because of donors.
I think also because of older Jews in Florida and those voters.
Man, I got to tell you, you know, I don't I'm not as familiar with the poll numbers, but just I kind of get the feeling that maybe the party leaders, the donation receivers, that they don't really have their thumb on the pulse of just how severe of a black and white type of issue this is for the left and for the young and for minorities and so forth.
When the parallels to Jim Crow and apartheid South Africa are so clear and because of the Internet and things that we don't have to rely on Tom Brokaw to explain who's occupying who anymore.
And and certainly on the left, it's it's a very kind of lightning rod sort of issue, too, because it's a pretty easy one once you learn about it, which, you know, which side you're going to be on on that.
And it seems like the irresistible force in the form of the donors and the party leadership versus the or actually strike that reversing the the immovable object is the leadership and the donors and then the irresistible force is the, you know, entire left half of the Democratic Party, the people they need to turn out to vote for them.
And it seems like this is just another issue where they're telling them, oh, yeah, no, we don't care what you think.
We're trying to win over.
We're going to invite John Kasich and Colin Powell.
We're trying to win over Republicans.
We don't care whether leftists vote for us or not, or we just assume they will or something like that.
I'm not sure.
But I we saw you lose with this same kind of strategy four years ago, you know?
Yeah, that's interesting.
You know, you've raised a number of questions.
I mean, one of them is, I mean, just on that strict political question, what do I know?
But I do think that Bernie Sanders and the left wing base have thrown themselves into this fight.
They regard Trump as such a threat to democracy that they are willing to shut up about certain issues.
And they won on some issues inside the Democratic Party.
They did not win on this issue.
And they were Biden said, I'm not even playing ball with you on this issue.
We're not we're not talking.
We're not negotiating on this issue.
We're behind Israel all the way.
We're not referring to the occupation or settlements as such in the in the platform.
This is going to be the most pro-Israel platform you've ever seen in your life.
And I go to your statement and I quest I guess I you seem kind of optimistic about what the the base is going to do on this issue, ultimately, that it's really going to bring about a.
Well, I just think they might stay home.
I mean, I'm not so excited about that, but I just wonder whether the Democrats are, you know, when when Biden named Kamala Harris, the New York Times perfectly reflecting what they were told by Biden staff and and so forth, campaign people and all that said, yeah, look, the rule here is do no harm.
The thing about Harris is she's entirely uncontroversial and satisfies everyone.
I really is that what you think that?
And I guess the idea is that she's black and she's a woman, that that'll be enough of a sop to the left for identity politics reasons, and that'll buy them off.
So they don't notice that she's as bad as Biden or Trump on this stuff.
But Scott, I don't think the left is fooled on Kamala Harris.
I don't either.
I think they hate her guts from what I can tell.
Yeah.
I mean, this is a person who has a long history as a prosecutor who doesn't seem to believe in, you know, very many progressive issues.
So I think the left is just going along with it because they want Trump out, you know, and but let's go back to what I think was optimistic on your part, that you think that the clear sentiment on the left base of the Democratic Party, that that is going to be politically persuasive ultimately.
Is that is that what I heard?
Well, not necessarily.
No, I mean, that's the I flubbed the whole line.
But the irresistible force in the unmovable object, you know, I'm just predicting a clash.
I don't know which, you know, how it's going to work out.
But it seems like, you know, the liberals, the Democrat Party people's policy is to try to ignore this and hope it'll go away and hope that the leftists won't be too loud.
Hope that direct comparisons to Mississippi in 1920 or whatever aren't spoken too loudly and and hope that they can whistle past the graveyard on the thing.
But, you know, remember a few years ago when there was that big in the convention in L.A. when they had a resolution on this and the nays had it by, you know, super majorities and the the chair just pretended that that wasn't true and let the pro-Israel resolution go through.
Yes.
I forget.
Barack Obama.
Something like that.
But at Barack Obama's direction, Obama said 2012, we are stifling this.
We are for Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
We're not allowing any dissent on this.
I need my donors behind me.
But it's like trying to stifle dissent over cops killing people that, you know, what we insist that this is an issue.
OK, we don't care whether it's, you know, Biden has decided that this is an issue this year.
OK.
You know, it's it's bubbling up anyway.
Yes.
And OK.
But go ahead.
I take your point.
OK.
I have been predicting a clash forever.
I predict, you know, it's just impossible.
These are two incompatible strains of thought.
You have a leadership saying there's no problem and the base saying it's apartheid.
I agree with you.
This is Mississippi 1920.
But my question at my point to you would be, yeah, guess what?
They put off the conflict in the base yet again this year.
But it they can't do it forever.
And I think it could.
It's going to break out even next year if the one if the Bernie Sanders people go along and they get Biden in.
And then, you know, as soon as he's in, the left says, where are you on this question?
We are no longer going to, you know, cover our heads, you know, and stick our heads in the sand.
That's what I think.
But hey, guys, Scott Horton here for Mike Swanson's great book, The War State.
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You know, I don't know, man, I got to say that, you know, just the way it's looking to me, all of the things being equal, even with the virus and every other thing in the economy and everything, I think Trump is still going to win because it's the same argument as, you know, Romney versus Obama in 2012.
There were plenty of people who absolutely hated Obama, but there were also a lot of people who really loved him.
And that's the same with Trump.
Nobody ever loved Romney.
Not even his family loves Romney.
Right.
And that's the same thing with Joe Biden.
People, they don't hate him the way they hate Hillary Clinton.
You know, I don't even hate him the way I hate Hillary Clinton.
Of course.
Yes.
But but but they don't love him.
They don't go, yeah, Biden, good old Biden.
Nobody feels that way about him at all.
And I think that's your margin right there, man.
You know, I frankly, yeah, I guess this is one of the reasons that people don't like him and trust him is because he's bad on stuff like this.
He's George W. Bush up there.
But people hate Trump.
I know percent of the country hate 60, whatever it is, that's a lot of you.
How do you overcome that kind of disapproval?
I don't think you do.
Yeah, I don't know.
But then again, I mean, Biden's like in hiding right now.
I'm barely aware he's running.
So that hasn't happened.
Hasn't that been an effective strategy so far?
Well, you know what?
That's what Hillary ran on in 2016 is I'm not Donald Trump.
And deplorables.
Yeah.
And anybody who does like him is a bad person.
Yeah, that'll do you real well.
You know, he's incapable of that type of type of statement, I believe.
And it's not his character.
And, you know, and here's the other thing, too, deliberately reaching across the aisle to the worst of the Republican war hawks, which you talk about one of your other articles here on Mondewise.net and bring in all of these, the very worst neocons and and even war criminals.
John Negroponte, Elliott Cohen and, you know, Elliott Abrams, these guys who lied us into war with Iraq.
John Negroponte, who helped the reinstitute the El Salvador option to replicate his war crimes, which was just putting Iran's men in the Supreme Islamic Council in power.
The bottom brigade there is the core of the Iraqi army and and making the Sunni insurgency that much worse, not quelling it at all horrible.
You know, these are the guys who are all now urging the American people to do the reasonable and responsible thing and line up and support Joe Biden.
And the Democrats are welcoming this.
See how reasonable we are.
Robert Kagan thinks we're cool.
And they think that that's going to work.
You know, the thing is, it is I would say it's a very broad coalition behind Biden.
It's kind of everybody except the people who love Trump.
Yeah.
Which, as you say, there are a lot of people who love Trump.
I think it's 30, 35 percent.
And I just got this note today from a left wing friend.
If Biden wins.
We go to war every time he pulls his centrist crap, we go after him.
I don't buy that he's really going left, but he is going to just take it from the left.
And I think that is going to be that's what the left is doing right now.
It is saying we're going to work hard.
We see a greater danger in Trump.
We are going to work hard and we will swallow anything as soon as you're in, man.
It's how it's it's pandemonium.
We are we're on we're after you on every issue that you try to.
Yeah.
But you know what it is?
It's that margin of just the people who stayed home, all the Obama voters who didn't show up to vote for Hillary because why bother?
They'd vote for him, but they wouldn't vote for her.
And I think that's what it is.
It's not the activists on Twitter that count.
It's the regular Joe's out there.
They're going to they're going to hate Trump enough to support this guy that they don't even really know.
But Scott, Scott, on that one, I think that you and me are regular Joe's in this sense.
We both, for whatever reason, I don't know your life path or whatever.
We really did not like Hillary Clinton.
And I don't it doesn't matter.
I mean, I I couldn't I'm in New York state, so it didn't matter who I voted for.
And but I would never poll ever for her.
It was my feeling.
And I just don't think vote Joe Biden has that degree of.
No, I agree with that.
I agree that his negatives have never been his heisers.
Mostly people think of him as kind of an affable guy.
But that's if they have a chance to shake hands with him at something which they don't have this year.
Yeah.
But you know, he's holed up somewhere across.
Don't you think it comes across?
He did that whole thing with the stuttering kid at the convention.
That was the biggest story of the convention.
I don't watch that crap.
You know, I don't know.
And you know what, too, is just the incumbency.
I mean, the guy's sitting in the chair already.
And that counts for a whole lot, man.
Like a local Afghan mayor or whatever.
We we keep the guy that's in there until we can't anymore.
That's how it usually goes.
And the only time that didn't happen was after it had been 12 years of Reagan and Bush.
And as you have documented so well, Bush turned against Israel.
And so the Israel lobby turned against him and for Bill Clinton and helped, you know, do everything they could to make that margin of victory.
And in this case, we have Donald Trump has no such problem with the lobby.
I don't think or I don't know.
Why do you think so many neocons hate him so much when he's so bad on Israel like them?
It's just because they're embarrassed by him.
No, I mean, I give look, as you say, it's not a right.
I mean, let's say you're a neocon and you love Israel.
That is really part of your core belief system is that we've got to support Israeli security.
And they really hate Trump and they have good reasons to hate Trump.
And they are supporting Democrats because guess what?
There's no liability in supporting Democrats.
Yeah, they're not any worse.
They're getting their agenda, they think, or pretty close to it.
And as you say, I mean, the most critical thing from my standpoint in the history of the neocons is in the 70s when McGovern runs.
And as a genuine they say, hey, Neil, they left the Democratic Party, the neocons on that occasion, because they said we need a big defense budget because we want American support for Israel.
So they don't trust some Democrats, but they trust Joe Biden, man, as you've pointed out.
Yeah, it's a hell of a thing.
And then so there's also the thing where he could drop dead at any time since he's already older than Reagan was when he left office.
Oh, is that right?
And so what I'll do, we really know about Harris and her positions on Israel, Phil.
OK, what we know about Kamala Harris, well, the first thing we know about Kamala Harris is that she's a superb politician and she has great political instincts.
And I think that, you know, she'll she'll say what she needs to say in any situation.
She'll reflect certain.
I mean, I don't know what she actually believes about Israel.
She claims that she raised money for Israel when she was a little girl, collected money to put trees on ethnically cleansed Palestinian villages.
And when The New York Times asked her during the Democratic primaries a year ago, they said, what do you think of Israeli human rights violations?
Kamala Harris gave them her them this dumbfounded look.
This is their greatest moment in the campaign from my standpoint.
Dumbfounded look and said, what are you talking about?
And The Times said, well, you know, they've committed human violations, human rights violations.
What do you think?
Do you have a problem with her overall record on this?
And she said, no.
You know, overall, no.
So she is right on the Israel lobby side, but she only got there in 2017 when she was 52 years old the first time, I guess, when she was aspiring to hire office.
I don't think I think that she would just as look, she's thrown her own career in prosecution and criminal justice.
I mean, she has thrown that under the bus to satisfy progressives.
And guess what?
I think that that's not something they have to worry about.
I think that she will follow the line that she says on that.
She will follow the current mood on that question.
And when Israel becomes, you know, Stinko in American politics, which it will someday, as both of you and I know, we're working to achieve that when it becomes the Jim Crow South, man, she's going to be right there, you know, saying screw Israel.
But until that moment, she's going to be talking to AIPAC and telling AIPAC how much she loves Israel.
I hope I answered your question.
Well, and she has she's gone and spoken to AIPAC and she's voted with Israel on everything in her time in the Senate and all that.
Right.
Yeah.
And when Buttigieg and however he pronounced his name, I forget it now.
When Sanders, when these others were boycotting AIPAC, she went, I can't wait to go to AIPAC.
You know, she's terrible.
That was terrible.
It's shameless.
And, you know, she was you know, she there are pictures of her with Netanyahu, you know, and she shouldn't have been going near Netanyahu in 2017 on her trip to Israel.
So.
Right.
Yeah.
Again, the whole thing about the trouble that Chuck Schumer should have been in, she could have been, too.
That's a kind of a middle finger to Obama in a way.
But then again, like Obama and Biden, both, they've always been willing to take it.
Remember that time that Biden was landing in Israel and they announced new settlements?
And so he punished Netanyahu by sitting angrily on his plane for an hour and being late for dinner.
It's the most embarrassing thing.
Yeah.
I mean, people told him to turn around and go home.
No.
And it was he gave a speech.
Bibi, this Bibi, that was behind Israel all the way.
We don't like we condemn these latest settlements, but I'm here, you know.
And that's what, you know, I have a story out today, which is kind of funny but tragic where there's a report that in 1982, when he was 39 years old and Joe Biden banged the table with Menachem Begin and said, hey, if you don't if you keep doing these settlements, we're going to cut off aid.
And The New York Times said it was, you know, the most angry meeting most senators had ever seen with an Israeli prime minister in 1982.
Biden's people are going out of the way to deny this story.
It's a canard.
It's a false story.
But it was in The New York Times 40 years ago and they're trying to deny it, you know, because they don't want a scintilla of daylight between Biden and Israel.
And they would rather just lie right to everybody's face than say Biden has learned the lesson since then that Judea and Samaria belong to the Israelis if they say so.
And which is his answer, really.
Right.
Right.
Which is swallow the insult.
You know, he was banging the table in 82.
But God knows he was sitting on the plane and getting off and, you know, kissing the ring in 2010.
And, you know, by the way, in this story today, I didn't know this until I was researching this.
But in November 2010, a few months after that incident you just described, Biden's meeting Netanyahu in New Orleans at the Jewish Federation's assembly, a big Israel lobby group.
And just as he gives this speech praising Israel to the skies and my last breath, I won't abandon Israel until the last breath is out of me, you know, I'd never turn.
You know, he comes to the hotel and he finds that they've announced more settlements, you know, and Blinken, his foreign policy guy, calls Michael Oren, the ambassador and icy voice.
You're going to be strategic consequences for this kind of that was 2010.
Nothing, nothing.
Blinken's with him today.
And they're just you know, there are never any consequences.
It's like no other country.
And that is the role of the lobby.
You know what?
It's not like this would ever serve as an excuse for Trump that he's so ignorant.
But on the other hand, it does make Biden that much more guilty that he's known since I was not quite in kindergarten, at the very least on the record, exactly what the deal is and how objectionable it is.
But don't you think a lot of people have known that in public life?
Yeah, I mean, well, you know what, I don't know the degree of knowledge of a lot of these people, but Biden does strike me as a type who would have looked at the map and understood the difference between this side and that side of the line, et cetera, like that.
I wouldn't say that for a majority of congressmen or senators, honestly, but certainly he knows better.
And if he's sitting there yelling at Menachem Begin about it, that means he understands exactly what was at stake.
And then that means he knows what all has been lost in the meantime, too.
And so for him to be as bad as he is now in the face of that is just that much worse.
It's on his resume to the destruction of the two state solution.
And yeah, I do.
But but but Scott, we talked about neocons earlier as as people who largely genuinely love Israel.
These people love it.
I mean, it's a miracle.
They really believe it's a miracle.
I mean, I know neocons who are an Israel lobbyist.
Generally, I know liberal Zionists.
They love Israel.
They believe it's a miracle.
Just they do.
You know, we can go into the motivation and the reasoning.
Kamala Harris, Joe Biden.
Hillary Clinton, Bill Clinton, any of these characters, do they love Israel?
They say it all the time.
We love it.
It's a miracle.
Do they actually feel that way?
I don't think so.
I think they know the story.
Well, I mean, look at Bill Clinton, you know, they got, you know, he they got the goods on him.
He just decided, you know what, I'm just going to pal around with Jeffrey Epstein and take an airplane to Thailand.
And you know what?
As long as I'm compromised by the Mossad, I'm going to go ahead and hire them to be the world's greatest pimps for me.
And we're just going to have a great old time getting drunk on some private islands and engaging in the most deviant behavior imaginable.
So do you think any of that is going to come out?
Well, I mean, we already know that he's flew on the guys playing 25 times, including to Thailand.
And we got two eyeball witnesses place them on the island.
Wow.
And we already know that he's a sick, demented freak anyway.
Yeah.
So, you know, never mind Lewinsky.
He beat that lady, Juanita Broderick, and raped her.
And her story is so credible.
Forget about it.
He's guilty.
I remember he beat her.
I know that there was a rape.
Oh, yeah.
He punched her in the face and he bit her on the face while he raped her like an animal, like some kind of savage attorney general.
Sounds about right to me.
Don't you think the Epstein thing, that's just too it's too low hanging fruit, red meat for the media to ignore?
Well, I mean, they love it.
They'll never put it in context.
They'll never go look.
This is a Mossad op to make sure that your senators stay in line.
In fact, I'm surprised that I'm truly surprised that Biden's name isn't on those flight manifests and so forth.
But I'm not surprised at all to see some of the people who were out at his ranch out in the middle of the desert or out wherever running around with this guy on the plane that everybody called it the rape plane.
We already knew.
Really?
And you know what?
There's a whole other story about Bill Clinton and his other friend who were brands or something like that, and they were flying around on what they called Air F1, you know, the F word there in the middle.
And this is all through the Bush Jr.years, I guess, you know, and they're just cruising all around.
And that just sounds to me like a guy who's compromise caught on tape and says, fine, just keep supplying them to me and I don't care.
And I that fits with Bill Clinton's personality to me perfectly, you know?
Yeah, I'm with you there.
I think that Bill Clinton doesn't really care.
You know, he's like Israel, Israel.
Bring on the children.
Yeah, that's funny, but, you know, when he's not burning them to death like a Waco or Iraq, he's raping them at the private island paradise.
Hmm.
Hmm.
Hmm.
Hmm.
Well, the Clintons don't win anymore.
Yeah.
You know, they don't have high favorability rating anyway.
Well, what do you think about the Epstein thing?
I mean, is this thing I mean, well, I guess they're still going to if they don't murder her first, they're going to prosecute the lady.
So that's going to be worth something.
Yeah, I mean, I hope she tells I hope she spills the beans, you know.
But I don't think she's going to live to see that witness stand.
Well, her elocution, I don't think that's ever going to happen.
Well, you know, you're not the only one who has cynical feelings about that.
Yeah, I should start gambling.
You know, it's funny.
I have to say that I was I want to write about this.
I was at a dinner party not long ago and where we were discussing this whole case.
And, you know, sort of New York privileged people and some of them with experience in the news media.
I won't go further than that.
And the question of whether Epstein, how Epstein died, came up and, you know, half the table said, well, he was killed.
Half said he killed himself.
You know, some conceding they didn't know.
But it was sort of, you know, when I was on the sort of I think he was killed or I don't know, but I just don't I certainly don't believe the official version.
I think there's more to this.
And at one point I just said, excuse me, but who do you who is a more reliable read on how society works?
William Shakespeare or The Wall Street Journal?
And, you know, everyone pretty much conceded it's William Shakespeare.
And I just don't understand in what way this Epstein thing is not Shakespearean, you know.
I mean, it's just not it's not something that The New York Times or The Wall Street Journal seems to understand the dimensions of this.
I mean, this is something they don't want to look.
I mean, it's they don't want to.
You can say the same thing about the entire relationship between Israel and the United States.
Yes.
I mean, would anybody be surprised that the Israelis would send their pimps to compromise all our lawmakers?
Of course they do that.
Of course.
That's the job of the counterintelligence division, the FBI, to prevent that from happening.
But they don't because they're probably a bunch of child rapists, too.
Right.
Well, they called it the honey trap.
And that's what they you know, it's in the movie Munich there.
They used women, you know, to get back, you know.
So I mean, and they got that guy Acosta says, hey, I was told to go light on this guy because he belongs to intelligence.
Yes.
And not to mess with him.
Well, come on.
He was CIA.
No, he was not CIA.
He was Assad.
Come on.
That's great.
All right.
I mean, I'm sure CIA was going along with it all along or whatever.
But it doesn't look like one of their ops to me, man.
That's funny.
But yeah, I'm in trouble because I just realized how late I am to interview Gareth because I'm just sitting here having a nice phone call with my friend Phil.
It's great.
OK, thanks, Phil.
Appreciate it.
See you, Scott.
Thanks a lot.
All right, you guys.
That's the great Phil Weiss, Mondoweiss.net.
And check out these.
Biden is the most pro-Israel nominee ever.
And the Democratic Party won't be out Israel this fall.
And Biden forces try to debunk story that he threatened to cut aid to Israel over settlements 38 years ago.
That's so funny.
The Scott Horton Show, anti-war radio, can be heard on KPFK 90.7 FM in L.A.
APS radio dot com, antiwar dot com, Scott Horton dot org and Libertarian Institute dot org.
