05/27/16 – Nasser Arrabyee – The Scott Horton Show

For Pacifica Radio, May 29th, 2016.
I'm Scott Horton.
This is Anti-War Radio.
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Introducing Nasser Araby.
He is a journalist from Yemen, on the line from Sanaa, Yemen now.
He's written for a great many different publications, including the Carnegie Endowment website, the New York Times, Foreign Policy, Bloomberg News.
And he runs his own media service company, Yemen Alon.
That's A-L-A-A-N.
Yemen Alon.
That means Yemen now.
And we'll just put him in your Google News and you'll find quite a bit.
Welcome back to the show, Nasser.
How are you doing?
Hi.
Thank you very much, Scott.
I really appreciate you joining us on the show again today.
And I guess, again, I'll start out with an apology for my country bombing yours.
Obviously, I can't really do anything about it except interview you.
But just so you know, most Americans know nothing about this war.
The American people are heroes and our friends, and they do sometimes more than Yemenis, I'm sure.
Yeah.
And, you know, most of us have no idea about this war, and I don't know what the numbers would be on support for it if people did know.
But anyway, many of us sincerely regret what's going on over there.
And now, so, I mean, that's where we need to start.
What is going on?
There was an announced peace deal.
And yet I still see reports of strikes from time to time.
Is the Saudi-American air war over Yemen still going on?
Yes.
The talks, the peace talks, the UN sponsored peace talks have been for 45 days now without progressing at all.
The war is still there.
The US-backed airstrikes are everywhere, killing people, sleeping in their houses.
Yesterday, a US-backed airstrike killed a 12-member family while they were asleep.
Only yesterday in Lahj.
So the war crimes are still going on, unfortunately.
And what's going on in Kuwait is something that's nonsense and fruitless because of Saudi Arabia is not clear in their position.
They say they are not doing anything but what the one who is fighting in the ground is Saudi Arabia with the Yemenis who are defending themselves.
And this is not the situation in Kuwait peace talks at all, at all.
And I think if they want to achieve anything, they should recognize that Saudi Arabia is doing the war in Yemen.
And then they would find a solution.
Okay, so in other words, what you're saying is the widely discussed ceasefire is really no ceasefire at all, even while the so-called peace talks are going on, which you're also saying the peace talks are going nowhere.
Yes, at all, at all.
The Saudi airplanes are flying and bombing around the clock.
I'm saying around the clock, all over Yemen, as they started in 26th of March last year.
So nothing, nothing changed at all, at all, at all, just the media and not more than that.
Wow.
Okay.
Yeah.
I mean, that's definitely a different narrative than the news stories would have it.
They would at least say that, you know, there may be a strike here or there, but that the overall campaign, well, the way they put it, the ceasefire largely is holding.
You can just imagine, imagine this on 22nd of May, that is about four days ago, people were rallying here in the huge square of Yemen, here in Sanaa, millions of people.
And the Saudi airplane came over them and bombed them directly.
Yes, by sound bombs, yes, by sound bombs, but they bombed them directly with pin bombs.
Just imagine this, please.
And is there, jeez, there must be coverage of that.
Yes, everybody, everybody knows this, but yes, they were sound, sound bombs, I'm saying, not real bombs, but they bombed millions of people rallying, millions of people celebrating the unity day.
I think everybody heard about this.
You're saying with, with what kind of bombs now?
Sound bombs?
Sound, just sound, not, not, not real bombs.
I mean, sound bombs just to scare people.
Yeah.
So you mean, oh, like a sonic booms in the air for breaking the speed of sound?
Yes, not, not, not bomb, not real bombs that, that killed people, no.
I see.
Sound bombs.
Sonic, sonic booms, you mean, for breaking the sound barrier?
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, breaking the barrier, yes.
I see.
Okay.
Yeah, I mean, that, okay, that's pretty ugly, you're right.
Not quite bombing the place, but yeah, no, I see what you mean.
But you're saying that from the declared ceasefire, that there was really no change in the actual bombing campaign?
No at all.
The, the, the, the, the front are going on, all the front on the ground and the, the, the bombing from the air.
So nothing at all changed, nothing at all changed at all.
And now, as far as the, the Houthis' power, they still hold all the power in the capital city?
Yes, of course.
Everywhere that they were in their positions and they are fighting and then everybody is fighting with them.
The army is fighting and the tribesmen are fighting with them everywhere.
The only thing that is, that is stopped is only in, in the, in the, in the, in the borders with Saudi Arabia.
This is something, a relative ceasefire, it is a relative halt, yes.
No clashes, no bombings, yes, this is the only thing that happened, but not because of the Kuwait talks, but because of another deal, direct deal between Houthi and Saudi Arabia directly that was held in one of the cities in the south of Saudi Arabia.
I see, but that's just the ground conflict at the border, but that has not stopped the airstrikes or the attacks by the Saudi forces in the south of the country?
With the borders, everything is stopped in the borders with Saudi Arabia.
Oh, okay, and the airstrikes too there.
But in the south, the war continues on?
Yes, but not because of the talks, not because of the talks, and, and, and, and, and not because of the UN talks, or not because of the UN declaration of the ceasefire, because of something between Saudi Arabia and Houthi, the real authority.
All right, and now, we know that the former dictator, Saleh, that he's now allied with the Houthis, and he brought many of his army divisions still loyal to him.
Are there any of the army divisions that have split off and are backed by the Saudis and the so-called Hadi government and are fighting on that side?
Or is the whole army on the side of the...
No single soldier is with Hadi, except, no single, all the army, all the army that was under Saleh is now under Houthi.
All the army, except the army that is in the far east of Hadhramaut.
That is, of course, neutral.
It is not fighting with anyone, but it is not fighting with, against Saudi Arabia.
But at the same time, it is still, they are still receiving their salaries from Sana'a.
Until this moment, I'm talking to you.
All right, and now, what about the blockade?
Has that been lifted at all?
Yes, the blockade is the biggest humanitarian crime that is being committed by Saudi Arabia and those who support them.
The blockade is destroying Yemen more than the airstrikes, because it is killing people every day.
You know, it is depriving the people from medicines, from the essential things, from fuel, from the essential food, from everything, from the life-saving things and needs.
So the blockade is violating the international law and the humanitarian laws and the human rights laws, but Saudi Arabia is imposing the blockade.
The blockade is still there.
And that hasn't changed at all under the UN deal?
At all.
At all.
Last week, only last week, there were two ships laden with fuel for the electricity of Hodeidah, where the temperature is about 40 now, and Saudi Arabia stopped them.
Saudi Arabia said, it is weapons from Iran, it is Iranian weapons.
And they stopped them.
This is how Saudi Arabia is killing Yemeni people with the, I mean, in front of the world.
Yeah.
Well, and we spoke before, the last time you were on the show, about how at the time the United Nations was saying that casualties, deaths were approximately 6,000.
And you said that that was vastly undercounting, and not just the battlefield deaths or deaths by airstrikes, but the casualties from starvation, malnutrition, and other forms of deprivation under this state of war.
Can you elaborate on that?
Yes.
Human rights, I mean, human rights agencies and UN agencies talk about about 30, 30 now, three zero, killed and injured.
And they put the death at 7,000, I think now, 7,000 or 6,700.
But this is very funny for us, as Yemenis, we know, either we know as witnesses, or as the human rights, the local human rights organizations, who are, who have their own statistics.
They talk about 50 killed and injured civilians, not because the military, they don't know about the military at all.
No one knows about the military.
But about 50,000 killed and injured civilians, this is what they talk.
Yeah, I mean, and that sounds realistic, too.
There's no reason I could think of to doubt numbers along those lines, especially since from the very beginning of the war, all of the international aid agencies said...
It's 15 months, Scott, you can just imagine, 15 months killing with the most advanced weapons, the most advanced weapons.
Well, in the poorest country in the Middle East, which is highly dependent on food imports, right?
I think cluster bombs, cluster bombs, just imagine dropping the cluster bombs into the most populated areas here in the capital of Sana'a, in the front of the world.
Nobody talked about this.
It is not me, a human rights organization, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International and all the respected human rights organizations talked about cluster bombs being dropped into Sana'a street.
Just imagine.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, it's Human Rights Watch and Amnesty and the rest of them absolutely have talked about that.
I mean, of course, we know that you and I know it kind of goes without saying, but we really have to emphasize here that all of these weapons are bought from the United States of America and that the war that the Saudis are waging here would be absolutely impossible without American coordination and effort, particularly in picking, helping to pick the targets and plot the courses and midair refueling and all of this.
I mean, to call it a Saudi war, it's true, but let's not let that obscure the fact that this is Barack Obama's war, lock, stock and barrel, that he could, in other words, he could certainly call it off just with a word.
He could end the war.
With a word.
This is something that everybody must know.
Obama gave them the green light only to blockade the Saudis who were angry because of the Iranian deal.
But I think blockading Saudis must not, at the expense of obliterating a whole country, Yemen.
This is something, you know, I remember today while he is in Hiroshima, and he was, you know, something like apologizing, but now he's making a war crime here in Yemen.
Yeah, well, and yeah, you guys aren't alone.
Join the club of people war crimed by Barack Obama in the last seven years.
I'll tell you what.
All right.
Now, so here's something that we have to talk about that is extremely important here.
And I know for the audience, it can be really hard to keep up with, you know, the Houthis, this and Saleh and Hadi and all these different factions.
You know, I'll encourage you all to read Nasser Araby and, you know, by all means, just keep up at antiwar.com, news.antiwar.com, cover Yemen all day, every day for you there to try to get a handle on this thing.
But the latest narrative, Nasser, is that now that we have a ceasefire, we can focus our attention on the al-Qaeda in Iraq and Islamic State forces that we've, oops, kind of been fighting for, for the last 15 months as we've been bombing their worst enemies, the Houthis.
And yet you're saying that the idea that the Hadi forces, the American and Saudi backed forces have now turned on the al-Qaeda groups in Yemen is just a lie.
That's your newest article I got a little preview of here.
You're saying that they claimed a massive attack against these al-Qaeda forces, 800 killed, and the whole thing was just made up.
Yes.
Unfortunately, there is a big misinformation misleading for Americans, unfortunately.
Not only in this situation in which they said they, they, they said they, they cleaned, they cleaned Muqalla, that is the fifth, the largest fifth city in Yemen.
They said they cleaned it, they cleaned it from terrorists in hours.
And they said they killed 800 in hour.
And I was the only one who said, no, this is not right, this is not, and I kept talking all the day until the world understood, because the exiled government in Riyadh said in a statement to the big agencies like the FBI and the waiters and, and they said, okay, we killed 800.
Now everybody knows that it was a big lie because al-Qaeda only withdraw according to a deal with Saudi Arabia and they, they, they withdraw in front of the people.
All the residents, local residents would tell you no single bullet was fired.
Al-Qaeda withdrew and the, the, the Saudi airplane came and bombed, only bombed some places and they said, okay, we are done now.
We are, we finished.
This is one thing.
So they are misleading and they are misinforming, unfortunately.
And at the same time, not only this, the people who are now called government in Riyadh, the three of them now are international or global terrorists.
They were designated by the, by the U.S. Treasury Department as global terrorists.
One of them is, was only proclaimed last week, Naif al-Qaisi, had he appointed him as a governor for al-Qaeda, for, for al-Bayda.
Al-Bayda is controlled by al, by al-Bayda, by the al-Qaeda.
And now this governor is working from Riyadh to facilitate the operations of al-Qaeda.
So with Saudi money and with American weapons, al-Qaeda is fighting in Yemen.
Al-Qaeda is fighting in Yemen and expanding.
This is a big problem.
The American people should know this.
The American people should listen to what the U.S. Treasury did only last week.
Who is Naif al-Qaisi and who is Abdul Wahab al-Humaykani and who is Abdul Wajid al-Zindani?
They are senior aides of Hadi in Riyadh in a, in luxurious hotel and they are leading and commanding and directing al-Qaeda operations in Yemen with Saudi money and with American weapons.
This is very dangerous and the American people should know this.
All right.
So now talk to me about the Islamic State there and there have been, you know, recent attacks attributed to them.
Are they competition for the al-Qaeda groups there in any way?
See, Scott, ISIS in Yemen, ISIS and al-Qaeda in Yemen is almost the same.
It is not clear as it is in Syria and Iraq and other places.
You know, the al-Qaeda senior leaders, almost all of them were killed by U.S. drones, right?
And the followers who are thousands and thousands and they are increasing, questioned the middle leaders and they accused them of conspiring.
They accused them of working with Americans or with Saudis or with something like this.
So I mean, the followers now are going to ISIS more than going to al-Qaeda because they say al-Qaeda is already infiltrated, al-Qaeda is already divided, al-Qaeda is not good for us now.
So ISIS now is recruiting more than al-Qaeda and it is more powerful.
And we can say everything that is under al-Qaeda is really ISIS now.
It is almost ISIS.
Okay, Nasser.
And so, you know, this is something we talked about on the show with Mark Perry.
He's a Pentagon reporter who talked about how some of the generals were really complaining about basically flying in their words as al-Qaeda's air force for the last year.
And they'll always click their heels and obey their orders and do it, but they would rather not.
And now, you know, what you're telling me, I think, is that al-Qaeda and or the Islamic State have made tremendous gains and are not just de facto benefiting from America's war against the Houthis, but they literally are part of the Hadi government that America and Saudi are attempting to install, reinstall in power in Sana'a now.
This is the most important thing.
There is one more important point, which is al-Qaeda is not now expanding and ruling only by force.
Al-Qaeda is also doing heart and mind battle.
Al-Qaeda now is meeting the educational needs and the economic needs of the people, especially in the south and in the east of the country.
So they do, they help them in education, they help the local people in education, and they help people in the health, and they help people in many other social activities, many, many other social activities, including also the solving of the problems, I mean, the disputes, the local disputes.
This is the most dangerous thing, also.
Where the money is coming from for this?
The money is coming from Saudi Arabia in now, sometimes formally, not only secretly as it was in the past, but now it came through the governor, through the minister, through the governors and ministers who were appointed by Hadi.
This is something that can be verified easily by anyone who wants to know the truth.
I mean, at least the three people, the three men who are now designated as global terrorists, and the last one was last week, as I told you, Naif al-Qaisi is a governor of al-Bayda, and he's working from Riyadh.
What is he doing?
He's just sending the money and directing al-Qaida and ISIS what to do and how to kill people.
And, as I told you, with American help and with American support.
Right.
So you've already said that in the talks in Kuwait, the Saudis refuse to really even make their position clear.
In other words, they're not really negotiating.
So do you see any kind of end in sight?
To be honest with you and with your audience, the pressure now, the pressure on Saudis and on UN and on the Yemeni conflicting bodies is much, much more than ever before from the international community, from the 18 ambassadors, so the 18 countries, like, I mean, YALS countries and the U.S. and the European Union and Japan.
So they wanted to finish this, and they know exactly where is the problem.
They know, but they can't say like I am saying now.
The United States knows, and everybody knows that if Saudi Arabia wants to finish it in minutes, it would finish it in minutes, and everything would be done, right?
But Saudi Arabia wants to say that it achieved a victory.
Saudi Arabia would not, does not want that, does not want the world to say that it was defeated in Yemen.
So Saudi Arabia wants to say that it is victorious, that it was not defeated in Yemen.
And I think there are people now, a lot of people, wise people, who would say, okay, but let's form a national unity government, and we come back to Yemen, and we solve everything.
I think now the negotiation in Kuwait, as I told you, they have been for 50 days, five zero, about two months now, because of this pressure.
Although the government, the exiled government, withdraw four times now, four times now, they suspend four times now, for very silly justifications.
But the international community exercised a big pressure, and they want to finish it, and I think there is a little hope, because the international community started to understand how to deal with Saudi Arabia, how to tell Saudi Arabia, now you are victorious, now you are okay, but please finish it.
And I think with this way, they could finish it, and also because of the deal with Houthi and Saudi Arabia on the border, I think this was the biggest concern with Saudi Arabia.
But of course, Houthis are now, I mean, the real authorities here, Houthis and their allies, they threatened, if Kuwait talks failed, the war would return to borders, the war would return into the cities and villages of Saudi Arabia, not only into Yemen, in Yemen only.
So Saudi Arabia, I think now, wants only to have a good exit, that will make the people or the world understand that Saudi Arabia was not defeated in Yemen, and I think they would tell Saudi Arabia that it was not defeated, but it must stop its war crimes against Yemenis.
Alright, thank you so much for your time, I really appreciate it Nasser.
Alright y'all, that is Nasser Araby, he is a reporter writing out of Sanaa, Yemen, and check out his own media service company, it's Yemen Alon, it's yemen-now.com.
Alright y'all, and that's Antiwar Radio for this week, thanks very much for listening, I'm your host Scott Horton, here every Sunday morning from 8.30 to 9 on KPFK 90.7 FM in LA.
You can find my full interview archive, more than 4,000 interviews now, going back to 2003, at scotthorton.org, and follow me on Twitter, at Scott Horton Show.
See you next week.