Sorry, I'm late.
I had to stop by the Wax Museum again and give the finger to FDR.
We know Al-Qaeda, Zawahiri is supporting the opposition in Syria.
Are we supporting Al-Qaeda in Syria?
It's a proud day for America.
And by God, we've kicked Vietnam syndrome once and for all.
Thank you very, very much.
I say it, I say it again, you've been had.
You've been took.
You've been hoodwinked.
These witnesses are trying to simply deny things that just about everybody else accepts as fact.
He came, he saw us, he died.
We ain't killing their army, but we killing them.
We be on CNN, like, say our name, man, say it, say it three times.
The meeting of the largest armies in the history of the world.
Then there's going to be an invasion.
All right, you guys, introducing Mike Swanson.
Of course, sponsor of this show.
He wrote the great book, The War State, a history of the rise of the new right military industrial complex after World War II in the Truman, Eisenhower, and Kennedy years there for you.
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It's great.
And also he gives investment advice at wallstreetwindow.com.
And hi, Mike, it's good to talk to you.
And it's been way too long since I talked to you and interviewed you.
And how in the hell are you?
Oh, I'm doing good, just like everyone else.
I'm just watching the world kind of go crazy, watching our political system like implode or something on a monthly basis.
At least that's what it feels like I'm watching.
And we haven't really talked in a while.
One of the reasons is when it comes to the financial markets, not a lot has really happened.
Or in my view, really been worth talking about for a while.
And that started to change last year.
And everything took a dump.
The market fell 20 percent.
And then recently, or now, it's bouncing back up.
And that's what has gotten everyone's attention, in the financial world at least.
Yeah, so that's my thing about it is that, you know, the show is mostly an anti-war show and not so much trying to convert people to Austrian school economics.
But it is extremely important to me, lots of different aspects of it.
But most importantly, I think, is the part of it, well, obviously the most important part of Austrian school economics, doesn't require for other people to necessarily agree with any other aspect of libertarian theory in any way.
To just understand that when the government serves as the backstop for the banks to expand the money supply, that that's what creates the essentially artificial booms that lead to the very real busts.
And that's why we have these economic crashes every 10 or 12 years or so, over and over again.
And of course, the free market takes the rap, and more government regulation is always the only solution.
And it happens over and over again.
So I think it's really important for people to understand that.
And it seems like you can have any political or economic philosophy and also accept just the reality of that and the way that that works.
And, you know, deal with other implications later kind of thing, I think.
And so I'm always really interested in that.
And I'm always really interested in, you know, trying to figure out where we are on the scale.
I know they created a lot of money to try to make up for the massive crash back in 2008 and the collapse of all the bad debt in the world, trillions of dollars worth back in 2008 and 2009 and what have you.
But so that just means I don't know where we are on the scale here.
The question is, like, how much of a correction was the recent crash compared to the reality?
Or say compared to 2008, something like that, so I can try to understand.
Well, I'll tell you about the stock that.
I'll answer that question first and then your earlier question, you know, how does the economics compare to the past?
But the stock market action is just almost a blip.
Frankly, last year in February, the Dow fell like 10 percent really quickly off the high.
And this time the markets fell 20 percent off their high.
Now, I believe that what that action represents is the start of a bear market that will last for quite some time, two or three years.
But when you have bear markets, you have rallies back up.
And I think that's what's actually occurring.
But if I'm right, that first drop is comparable to the fall of 2000.
There is a decline that started that bear market and that bear market lasted for two years.
Then the 2008 situation, the stock market fell, kind of had a similar drop from October to January 2008 and then rallied in the summer, then crashed in the fall.
But those first drops in bear markets that go on for two or three years, they are kind of like the way this one played out.
They happen.
They catch people's attention.
But they don't really scare that many people out of the stock market.
People just tend, who are fully invested, they just hold and just think, oh, it's just temporary.
And then you'll get the rally back up, which seems to be what's happening.
And then they just get complacent again.
But if this really is the type of bear market I think it is, what will happen is this rally could go a little bit more, a couple more weeks, maybe into April.
But before the year is over, we'll be making new lows.
We'll go below the December lows.
And then that would be a sign that this is really going to last.
And it's not just a correction.
Most people think it's just a correction.
On CNBC, for example, Jim Cramer this weekend said this drop, 20%, was a bear market.
Now we're in a new bull market.
It's just going to go up.
And that's kind of the mentality of most stock market people because they're fully invested in the market.
But the bear markets kind of have a cycle to them.
The way they play out, the first drop is denial where people will see it fall and just ignore it.
And then as it goes on and on, they get more and more – people get more and more bearish and negative.
So, like in 2008, the market really fell for a year going into the crash of 2008.
And no one cared for the most part until it crashed in October.
They were already losing 30%, 40% of their money.
But then when it really fell real fast and all the bad news came out, they got scared.
And one thing that happens in a big stock market bear cycle is most – they start out and you don't really know the cause of it.
And then what happens is when it's over with and things get really – the market has – there's real panic and more fear going on.
There will be negative news stories about what the real cause of this down cycle is.
So, in 2008, the banks were bankrupt for a year on their balance sheets.
Those mortgage securities that caused the banks to go under, they were worth zero for a year.
And no one cared.
And you could find that out, that that was going on.
They knew.
And I had an inkling of this in the spring of 2008 that there were serious problems because people wrote about it.
It's not – I got secret information.
But it wasn't until the crash that the bad news became widely known.
In a certain sense, something sort of similar happened in 2000 in the sense that the – in the 2000-2003 bear market, the internet bubble bust.
But the economy didn't really get into a recession except for the internet sector, Silicon Valley and so forth until after 9-11.
So it just takes – I guess another way to put this is when a big bear market starts, I think this is one, at the first part of it, it's only stocks that fall.
And the economy itself usually doesn't slow down for another six to 12 months.
And then the ultimate cause, like if there's really bad news, bad debts or something lurking, it's not – doesn't show up until you get to the end.
And then everyone kind of goes, oh, no.
So I'll say what is the potential bad news and how does that – or debt problems and how does that fit in of Austrian economics.
It's kind of what you were going at first.
When I first got interested in trading and investing in – it was in the late 90s.
And Ron Paul is a fellow that got me interested in libertarianism and Austrian economics because I was watching him on CNBC and C-SPAN.
And the question now on Greenspan is this internet bubble is collapsing.
And Paul would explain the cause of it, how the bubbles work to me and hundreds of thousands of people, if not millions, watching.
And so I read Ludwig van Mises and some of their works of other Austrian thinkers.
And their basic idea is that the government and the Federal Reserve, they keep interest rates too low for too long.
They misprice inflation.
They can't perfectly control interest rates.
So they tend to err on the side of creating inflation, creating too much money, which creates a misallocation of capital.
And the internet stocks was such a clear example of this.
The real estate bubble, another example of this.
So we've experienced this.
However, neither – as far as I know, Ron Paul nor Ludwig van Mises had a theory of at what point does a bubble or the debt situation get so bad that it all blows up.
And I want to tell the audience to refer to them to two works that are by economists and ones by a giant fund manager.
They're not necessarily – I don't know if they'd call themselves Austrian economics, but one of the books is called This Time is Different.
And it came out after 2008.
And what the authors did was look at like 1,000 years of financial history to figure out when does a bubble blow up, when does an economy blow up and the financial system blow up, and how long does it take to get out of the situation, and what's the commonality of all this.
And what they found was that they looked at the current account deficit.
And when it gets over 5 percent GDP, that's when a country tends to run into big trouble.
So that happened in the United States around 2002, 2003.
And the current account deficit is – it includes the trade deficit and the money a country borrows from other countries to finance its own government deficit or its trade deficit.
So it's really the current accounts, how much money as a percentage of GDP we're borrowing from the rest of the world.
But at the time of the 99 bubble, that was when they were running at least a so-called surplus for the first time in forever, right?
Yeah, that's right.
That's right.
So that was an internet – that was purely really the internet stocks that blew up.
And it didn't necessarily or didn't really affect the entire economy.
It was more like a stock market bubble.
In a certain sense, the 87 crash could be seen as more of a financial stock market bubble and not one affecting the whole economy.
But their claim is that when you get to the 5 percent GDP point, what ends up happening is the banking system and the bond market starts to get into trouble.
And that's what really causes in the end a real economic calamity.
It's not necessarily – And is that what precipitated the crash in 08?
Yeah, yeah.
That's really what happened.
It was the banking system.
The interest rates were so low that people started to go crazy buying houses and people know that story.
But the banks issued all these subprime loans that really shouldn't be given out.
And if interest rates were higher, those loans never would have been made.
And the problem was those – it was something like 10 percent of the balance sheets on all the biggest banks in the country were in these loans that ended up being worth nothing.
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Now, so here's one thing, though, is, first of all, I think, just to clarify, you meant no slam on Ron Paul to say he has not a theory of timing.
Because that's what he says, is that in Austrian economics, I can tell you that it's going to bust, but I can't tell you when it's going to happen.
But on the contrary, though, I actually talked with Ron Paul about this in the summer of 2008, I think as the campaign was winding down anyway or something like that.
And I was asking him about, maybe it was a little earlier, but I was reading Gary North at lourockwell.com.
I've always been more of an LRC guy than a Mises.org guy, just because I only got so many hours in the day.
So he was like a very educated Austrian school theory, gold money curmudgeon kind of a guy.
And I liked reading him, and he was constantly harping on the M1, M2, and M3 measure of the money supply.
The checkbook money this, and the different kinds of securities that.
And he was saying, look, there's massive deflation going on in the money supply.
The bust is coming soon.
Everybody get out.
Everybody flee to New Zealand.
Whatever.
He didn't say that, but I'm just saying, he was saying, the crashes are coming.
And I remember asking Ron Paul about that and saying, look, we talk about the Fed and inflation, inflation, inflation all the time, of course.
But right now, don't we have a real collapse in the money supply?
And he's saying, yeah, Gary North is right about that.
And times are tough.
And then it was just one month later.
I mean, this was in August of 2008.
And then in September, it crashed.
Well, and today, they don't even report those numbers anymore.
Yeah.
Well, but there must be shadow M3 numbers, right?
Do you look at those?
I don't, but I'm sure someone's got some out there.
So let me ask you about this.
Do I even have it right?
Because it seems like, you know, as an economist, I'm a great anti-war guy, to paraphrase Lou, about someone else on a different topic.
So it seems to me like there's a couple of paradoxes in the economy right now, in terms of, I guess, government policy, where you have, on one hand, tariffs and higher interest rates, anyway, relatively higher, as the Fed keeps raising the overnight rate.
And these are deflationary pressures on the economy, kind of pushing down on all of this stuff and possibly popping it.
But then, on the other hand, you have tax cuts and, overall, still artificially low interest rates, which both of those are still inflationary pressures for the building up of the bubble.
So I wonder how you think those balance out, or if it's even a contest or what.
And I guess you're saying we're at the beginning of the end for this cycle, anyway.
Yeah, I believe we're at the end of the cycle.
And that's what I made these videos saying.
That's the basic argument, is the stock market tops, the sign that it's in the cycle.
But more important than that, and it is a real forecasting tool, is that interest rates, even though they've been raising interest rates, they do that on the one-year rate.
They manipulate the shorter-term rates, the one-year, six-month, and so forth.
And the overnight rate is always a big indicator, right?
Right.
I love telling this story.
I know a guy who built concrete skateparks for a living, a true hardcore skateboarder here in Texas, and owned this construction company, building skateparks all across the West.
And he read the Wall Street Journal every day.
And as soon as they started raising the federal funds rate, that was when he sold all of his equipment and everything, and went to weather the storm in semi-retirement until conditions were right again, and let somebody else take the loss on the unused bulldozer.
Well, the way to really know when the moment is that things are at the end is the Fed raises these short-term rates, but then you have 10-year bonds and 20-year bonds that people trade.
And they have their own rate to them, and the Fed doesn't really influence them.
And what will happen when you get to the end, those long-term rates stop going up, even though the Fed's raising rates.
And you can get to a point where the 10-year bond is lower, the interest you'd buy for a 10-year bond is lower than what you get on one year.
And that's called an inverted yield curve.
And what happens is that people buying these long-term bonds, they're forecasting a recession or at least saying the Fed's going to stop raising interest rates.
And we're at that moment, basically, where these rates are just about even.
So that's what makes me say and think that the market and the economy is at the end of this expansionary cycle.
But with the tax cuts and the tariffs and all these other factors, I don't really – the tariffs is kind of – I don't really know how they're directly influencing the financial markets.
I don't – I can't – I don't know what to point to to make a claim one way or the other.
But with the tax cuts, they certainly helped make the stock market go up last year.
And it contributed to something that was already going on.
So in 2000 – around 2013, the Federal Reserve started something called quantitative easing.
And they lowered rates to zero.
And then they wanted to keep stimulating things even more.
They got scared we'd go into a recession or the stock market would have another bear market.
And they didn't want it to happen.
So they basically started buying bonds, about $50 billion a month.
Some of them were treasury bonds.
Most of them were bonds from banks.
But one reason they were doing this is we had a big trade deficit with China.
And China was no longer buying enough government debt to finance our whole deficit.
So the Fed, in a sense, stepped in there.
But what this did was it lowered rates even more, in particular in the corporate bond market.
And corporations, starting in 2013, started to borrow money by issuing bonds at low rates and buying back their stock.
And then in 2016, the Fed accelerated this whole process, did another round of this quantitative easing.
And the banks went on a complete lending – or borrowing.
I mean, not the banks.
So the corporations, such as Apple, all of them that you can think of, just borrowed and borrowed and borrowed to buy their own shares off the stock exchange.
And that helped make the stocks go up.
And to give two more real-life examples that are just what's the stock market doing, if you take Tesla, the company Tesla, they don't turn a profit.
And today, they just announced they're laying off 10% of their workforce.
And Netflix is another company.
They don't turn a profit.
And both these companies, though, have borrowed massive amounts of money by issuing junk bonds.
I believe they're complete bubbles, both of them.
Uber, too.
I read a great slam on that company's model.
Oh, I believe it.
But I would assert that these companies wouldn't even exist if it wasn't for this quantitative easing program that made the junk bond market create this opportunity for these people.
And when Trump and Congress did the tax cuts, they basically enabled these companies to do this even more.
Now we're getting some money back that we didn't have before, so let's go out and buy more stocks.
So last year saw a record number of share buybacks by corporate America.
And that's been the real contributor to the economy instead of hiring people or building plants.
In fact, in the last three months of last year, industrial production would have shrunk if it wasn't for military spending.
So in some ways you could figure it out that almost half of the growth in industry since Trump has been elected has been due to an expansion in defense spending.
I'm not putting a judgment on it.
I'm just trying to say that's what happened.
Same thing with the tax cuts.
I know you're not slamming tax cuts in principle.
You're just saying that's part of the landscape of this context of what's going on.
Well, I think the real problem, it's not so much that the tax – I think the real problem is that for whatever reason, our economy in our lifetime, and I believe it's gotten worse, there's some sort of structural problems with it as far as getting really good jobs to people and raising wages and so forth.
I think it's been like this since the 70s for multiple reasons, and therefore Trump or anyone else at this point, by simply lowering taxes, isn't enough to create the kind of boom we would all like to see.
So I don't think the problem isn't tax cuts.
It's some sort of multiple – I mean it's a whole other conversation.
Well, I mean, just within this conversation, because you're right, there's a hundred different things to take into account.
But just in this context, the boom and the bust cycle doesn't help where everybody who's like a mildly successful entrepreneur gets the rug pulled out from under them every decade or every dozen years.
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But so now, this time around, you're saying this is one correction of a cycle of corrections coming kind of thing.
But are you really comparing this era now to 2008 or to 99?
Like you said, 87 and 99, those really represented just bubbles in the stock market that were then corrected in the stock market, while the rest of the larger bubble, for example, in housing, continued on up until that massive structural collapse of everything in 2008.
Is this going to be like that?
I guess this is sort of part of the same question of, just how much money was that QE?
And how different was that monetary inflation after 2008 and the crisis of 2008 compared to, for example, the Greenspan bubble from 99 up until 2008?
OK, yeah, that's the big question.
And I have Ron Paul up next, so he's going to be checking your work.
Oh, great.
Good.
No, I'm just kidding.
Go ahead.
We're going to talk about Siri.
OK, right now, the current account deficit is less than 3%.
So that indicator is not at an alarming level.
However, there's another indicator that is just as important.
And I would tell people to look this book up, and it's free.
It's called Big Debt Crises, and it's by Ray Dalio.
It came out a couple months ago, and he does the same thing as the other authors.
It's kind of like a reference book, the way it's written.
But he's examining all the market movements of the past 100 years and when these debt problems blow up.
And the indicator he looks at is the government debt to GDP.
I should put it another way.
The debt to GDP of a country, that's the government debt plus public debt.
And that, historically, when that gets above 100%, there's some sort of big problem.
That's when governments run into trouble with their own debt.
So this is what happened in Japan in the 90s.
Well, is this just a correlation, or you can really see why that is?
That once there's three digits in the number, people panic, or what?
Well, it— Are there some kind of curve that says it'll never be paid off now?
Is that it?
Well, here's the problem.
Okay, so in Turkey, this just happened.
The crisis playing out there.
In the United States, the last two times it happened was in 1929 and then after World War II, actually.
And there was a big correction in the economy after World War II.
People don't know it, but there was for like two years.
There was a deflationary cycle that took place.
And in other countries, it was even worse.
So actually, the Soviet Union devalued their currency by 90% after World War II.
And England ended up having a big, big debt crisis.
But what happens is when you get to the 100% point, it's not— And I don't think this is going to happen today or maybe even this year.
But it makes a situation where people— There's a risk that this whole debt will never be paid off.
Not at the current— It's just unsustainable.
So the only— And especially if you get into a recession.
So I think the big danger isn't today.
But if the stock market is down 12 months from now and we have a recession, then I think we're likely to see the bond market go into a bear market.
And this will be the big story in two or three years.
How's the housing bubble looking right now compared to the last time?
Well, the same sort of things have happened.
We have seen in some houses— I mean, you mentioned that movie, The Big Short.
So people who have seen that have seen where they go to Miami, right?
And there's mansions everywhere and nobody's living in them and nobody's really paying for them.
And they've all been essentially in default for more than a year now.
And yet everything—everybody's pretending it's still going on.
You know about L.A. and Southern California and Las Vegas, where it just becomes everybody's flipping like a Chinese ghost city.
Nobody lives there and the whole thing is just an investment, a short-term turnaround, kind of almost pyramid scheme type of game that cannot last.
Is this like that?
I don't think it's quite like that.
However, in some markets, the real estate prices have gone up over the past couple of years, again, because interest rates were so low, again.
And they have actually come off over the past six months.
And you see stories like they're not selling as many houses in New York City and so forth.
But I don't really believe that there's a big bubble of widespread— I don't think this—it's nowhere like it was 10 or 15 years ago, like a complete mania.
I mean, I had relatives flipping houses and doing all this stuff.
And I don't think that's a big problem on bank balance sheets like it was back then.
But definitely in some areas of the country, the real estate prices did go back up.
I'm sorry if I'm getting away of your story with all of my kind of ridiculous side questions.
I'm trying to catch up on years of neglect of this issue.
One thing that I think nobody ever answered for me, Mike, was—maybe I never asked him.
We used to hear all the time about, OK, they created all this QE money.
But then they realized that they couldn't just dump all this currency into circulation, that it would cause massive price inflation across the board and would be a massive destabilizing thing.
So they came up with this ingenious policy for, I guess, the first time, where they would pay the banks a better interest rate to keep the money parked at the Fed.
So in other words, they created enough money at everybody else's expense through the later price inflation although at a lower level, to keep all the banks whole.
In other words, a backdoor bailout of all of the banks to keep them from going under.
But then at the same time, they paid the banks to not loan all that money out to regular schmucks because that would cause the bubble to get too far out of control.
But then, I never heard Chapter 2 or 3 of that story about what happened to that money and if that's still the case and when will it not be and what is the deal with that?
Well, you're basically asking what happened in the past five years, I think, is a way to put what you're saying.
Yeah, and hurry up and sum it up for me, too, in a nutshell.
No, I'm just kidding.
No, but I really think with the banks that that program worked and they basically got the bad debt off their balance sheets and kind of have stabilized themselves.
And so then the central bank just sort of reabsorbed the remainder?
Yeah, basically.
And that's what some of this quantitative easing stuff was.
They were buying the bad debts that these banks had.
So in one way, I mean one crude way to, I think, this whole process is in 2008 the banks were bankrupt and the government bailed them out and took what was a crisis for the banks and made it into a taxpayer or debt bailout through all these programs.
Obama, when he got in office, the government deficit was a trillion dollars and much of it given to that TARP program.
But that program and these things did not make the day-to-day life of most Americans better.
Didn't provide bailouts to people who lost their homes or whatever.
Not saying they should have got one either.
But so we're left with watching the last election of Clinton and Trump.
And that's why Trump won, I believe.
Yeah, well that and some other things too, but yeah.
All right, so now, you know, I don't want this.
I don't think it has been any kind of infomercial, although I probably owe you a few of those for how generous you've been in helping to support the show all this time, Mike.
But so, I mean, I guess let me ask you, other than people going to Wall Street Window and signing up and getting your regular advice, just in the most general sense, how do people protect themselves from this kind of intervention in the economy and all the mispricing and all the corrections to come here?
I mean, in the short term or medium term.
I mean, this is what I tell people I know that live around, you know, friends of mine that aren't trying to trade the markets or something like I do.
And honestly, I think the most important thing people in the stock market can do is not be 100% invested in the stock market.
And it's common sense.
But most investment advisors and the financial media will tell you be 100% invested, never get out because you might miss out.
And I think it's bad advice.
It seems like the only smart thing to do would be to bet against all of this stuff, all of these banks and all these tech companies.
When I saw that Amazon is worth a trillion dollars now, I thought, I wish I knew how to do one of those double-blind short-sell things, man, and screw them good.
I could have made a billion dollars last year betting against Amazon, right?
Muckerman.
Yeah, well, it's gone up a little bit.
But yeah, no, I mean, that's what I try to do.
It's not as easy as it sounds.
And when you short stuff, you've got to get out if you're wrong, because you can lose just more if something goes up from $10 to $100.
That's a lot of money you lose.
But the average person, you'd not be 100% invested in the stock market.
But the other thing I think people need to do is own – I mean, I sound like an infomercial myself when I say this, but own some gold and silver, you know, because if this stuff blows up, then gold and silver will go up.
And regardless, I actually did a study myself going back like 30 years of financial data, and if someone had a third of their money in stocks, a third of their money in bonds, and a third of their money in gold starting like 30 years ago, they would beat the market anyway.
And they only would have lost like 10% in 2008 because bonds and gold went up.
The problem is there will be investment advisors that tell people, okay, we want to be more conservative, so put half your money in bonds and half your money in stocks, because historically bonds go up when the stock market falls, treasury bonds I'm talking about.
And yeah, that is a good strategy.
However, if my fear is correct that the U.S. is going to have a debt crisis, that strategy won't work.
You'll need gold or silver, and so I think that's really what people should do, put 10%, 20% of their money in gold and silver, and whatever they do with the rest of it, you know, it's up to them.
Now this debt, the real debt crisis you're talking about, that'll be the consequence of all the inflation to make up for the next crash?
Or that'll be the next crash?
I think that will be the cause of it.
And when I say crash, I don't think it's happening this year.
Usually a crash is a culmination of a market already declining.
So very rarely does it just, you know, next week it crashes, we just made a new high.
Usually it's a panic event from people who are already losing lots of money, and then they just can't take it anymore.
But like you said, though, the last time we had, in the crash of 08, everybody ran to government securities and helped prop those up.
You're saying that won't work?
Yeah, I don't believe, I believe this time around that won't work, and that will be something unique in our lifetime.
It actually happened in the Great Depression for a period of time, which is an interesting comparison.
And I think there could be some similarities.
What happened in the Great Depression in 1929 after the stock market crashed, it all rallied back up for six months or so.
And then when it had the next leg down, interestingly enough, the bond market fell in the United States and across the world.
And there was actually deflation in the United States in the first round of this drop.
And this decline in the bond market is really what hurt U.S. banks and caused that famous banking crisis that happened.
And we all know the history.
World War II saved us from the Great Depression.
I'm sorry, I've got to go.
I'm late.
Thank you so much, Mike, for coming on the show, man.
Appreciate it.
Great talking with you again.
Yeah, you too, man.
Okay, guys, that is the great Mike Swanson.
He wrote The War State, which is a great book that you'll love to read and give to your friends.
And then also he does investment advice for you at wallstreetwindow.com.
Hey, guys, this is Bert and Car from the Friends Against Government podcast here.
And you've probably heard Scott talk about the crowdsourcing effort on Reddit about his upcoming book.
All you got to do to get in is to donate $5 a month to Scott's Patreon and request to join the private Reddit group.
In Scott's Reddit group, you will find a pin post outlining the details for how you can help find source material for Scott's upcoming book by listening to archived interviews and taking a few notes.
If you have any questions, feel free to reach out to either myself, at Bertarkist, or Car, at carcampit on Twitter, and we'll be happy to help.
We look forward to seeing you in there.
All right, y'all, thanks.
Find me at libertarianinstitute.org, at scotthorton.org, antiwar.com, and reddit.com slash scotthortonshow.
Oh, yeah, and read my book, Fool's Errand, Timed and the War in Afghanistan, at foolserrand.us.
