Download Episode.

Scott interviews James Carden on the National Conservative Conference that he recently attended. Carden and Scott talk about what the conference was like, who was funding it, why antiwar types ought to be concerned about this movement and more.

Discussed on the show:

• “The Future of NATO” (Quincy Institute)
• “Neoconservatism by Another Name” (The American Conservative)

James Carden is a columnist and senior advisor to the American Committee for US-Russia Accord (ACURA) and a former adviser on Russia policy at the US State Department. His articles and essays have appeared in a wide variety of publications including The Nation, The American Conservative, Responsible Statecraft, The Spectator, UnHerd, The National Interest, Quartz, The Los Angeles Times, and American Affairs.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: Roberts and Robers Brokerage Incorporated; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; Libertas Bella; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott.

Get Scott’s interviews before anyone else! Subscribe to the Substack.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjY

Doug Bandow comes back on the show to explain the importance of America taking a backseat with Ukraine, particularly with respect to its dispute with Russia over Crimea. Bandow reminds us that Crimea has historically always been a part of Russia, and that it was seized back from Ukraine with relatively little violence and general support of the population. Bandow sees it as oddly selective to vehemently oppose Russia’s authoritarianism when the U.S. seems perfectly willing to support other oppressive governments, like Saudi Arabia, and thinks it’s extremely dangerous to stoke up essentially unnecessary conflicts with nuclear-armed countries.

Discussed on the show:

• “Time to Extricate From Ukraine” (The American Conservative)

Doug Bandow is a senior fellow at the Cato Institute and a regular contributor at Forbes Magazine, the National Interest, and elsewhere. He’s on Twitter @Doug_Bandow.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Scott talks to Dan McAdams about the U.S. withdrawal from northeastern Syria, and the ensuing negotiations between Assad, the Kurds, and Turkey. McAdams reminds us that the whole crisis was only precipitated by America’s decision to intervene in Syria’s civil war, a thinly-veiled attempt to overthrow the Assad regime. Scott reminds us that, as usual, it’s really all about limiting Iran’s influence in the Middle East.

Discussed on the show:

• “Veterans doubt value of wars in Iraq, Afghanistan in new poll” (Military Times)

Daniel McAdams is the executive director of the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity and the co-host of the Ron Paul Liberty Report. Follow him on Twitter @DanielLMcAdams and read all of his work over at Antiwar.com.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.Audio Player

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Elizabeth McAlister of the Kings Bay Plowshares 7 updates Scott on her legal situation, following an April 2018 incident in which she and other members of her organization broke into a Nuclear Submarine facility. The Kings Bay Plowshares are a group of Catholics dedicated to peacefully protesting America’s use of nuclear weapons, which, as McAlister reminds us, have the potential to end all life on Earth. McAlister was recently released from jail, and continues to await her trial.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

–SCOTT HORTON SHOW EPISODE 5095–
–TRANSCRIBED BY WILL W. GRIGG–

SH: Alright you guys, very special guest today. I’m joined on the line by Elizabeth McCallister from the Jonah House and the Plowshares, and of course she is one half of the most famous anti-war couple in American history, really, with the late Philip Berrigan. She’s the mother of our friend Frida Berrigan — great friend of the show we’ve interviewed many times here. We’re very happy to welcome you to the show, how are you doing, Elizabeth?

EM: I’m doing just fine, thank you. And Frida will be in town for the trial.

SH: OK, yeah, well and that’s what we’re here to talk about is the trial — when does it begin?

EM: Monday.

SH: And this is regarding an action that your group, the Kings Bay Plowshares, committed on April 4, 2018. Could you please tell us about it?

EM: Well, we went to the Kings Bay Naval Weapons Station and we went to 3 distinct sites in small groups. One group went to the shrine and made their presence felt there. Three of us went to a section up on the hill and close to their nuclear weapons and the third group went to the administration building and left many messages there. So we were pretty present to different moments and different works that the plant is about. Of course, it’s about nuclear weapons and the nuclear weapons that are carried by the Trident submarines would be enough to destroy everything on Earth, which is what we’ve learned over the period of study leading up the action.

SH: And you guys chose April 4 for a very specific reason as well, is that right?

EM: That’s correct. The anniversary of the assassination of Martin Luther King. We wanted to remember his witness and to celebrate it.

SH: And that’s an important point — his “witness,” as you call it. This all is very religious to you: your motivation here is your Christianity, is that correct?

EM: That’s correct. It’s Christianity, but it’s humanity, and it’s Earth, and the reality is that everything is up for grabs with these weapons. People, places, history. There is enough firepower on the base right here in Kings Bay to make it that — if that were ever used, we have read — that’s the end of life on Earth. It would spell the end of life on Earth if the firepower on each of the Trident submarines home-based here were ever used. Now that’s sobering.

SH: Because of the nuclear winter, you mean.

EM: Well, the effect of the weapons themselves, yes. They affect climate, they affect everything. They affect the air we breathe, they affect the soil. And it’s just a very, very dangerous weapon.

SH: Well, I have to tell you, I have no idea when I first learned of you and your husband, but I’ve always known about these Catholic priests and nuns who go and protest the nuclear missiles and make a controversy out of America’s nuclear arsenal when most of America just never pays attention to this issue at all. I think you and your groups that you have done these actions with over the years deserve the lion’s share of the credit for people even thinking of nuclear weapons as controversial at all. Most of the time they still go without saying anyway, that it’s just part of our security but I don’t think that people can imagine what it would be like to really see an H-Bomb go off over an American city.

EM: No, the thought is horrendous, and that’s why most people don’t think about it. But I do want to say that we are far from alone. We are surrounded going into our trial by some extraordinary human beings who are attorneys and who are just the most thoughtful, prepared, intelligent people, and human. And they’re beautiful human beings. And the privilege is to be able to work with them and to have them share their powers and their training with us. So the trial should be very, very strong, and very fine, thanks to them.

SH: And they’ve already said in the news that they mean to mount a religious freedom defense, is that correct?

EM: Well, I’m sure that’s going to be at least part of it if not the whole thing, yes. That’s correct.

SH: That’s very important because of course right next to how much American society cherishes our nuclear weapons we cherish our 1st Amendment and even out of all five protections in the 1st Amendment the freedom to worship as one sees fit or not or otherwise I think is the one that everyone can agree on as the single most important right of all. To be protected.

EM: That’s very, very true.

SH: And they’re trying to put you in jail for 25 years here — in prison, for 25 years, is that correct?

EM: I thought it was 26, but I will not argue over a year. I have already served 1 year and 8 months for this in the local jail.

SH: So does that mean they refused to bail you out, or you refused to be bailed out?

EM: I refused the conditions of release until they finally just released me without conditions.

SH: I see. I had read that a few got out and were on house arrest with ankle monitors and that kind of thing, right.

EM: Yes. Clare Grady just had her ankle monitor removed the other day and she’s been out for months. I had it for 3 or 4 days and they took it off. My release was very, very, weird and an utterly unexpected and unprepared for thing. They just wanted me out, and so I’m out.

SH: You’ve been through this quite a few times. I know you and your husband have served not just time in jail, but time in prison over the years for these kinds of actions. How severe are the charges here compared to previous actions?

EM: I think that the charges are not different, I think the consequences are a little more steep than what we’ve faced before. But not that much. What is it, 20-some years in prison? This is a figure I’ve heard, I haven’t explored it, though. We’ll see. But if it’s 26 years, I probably won’t make it [laughs].

SH: And how many times have they sort of backed down and let you go with time served in the past versus really seeking to press the charges as hard as they can?

EM: Well, never.

SH: They always really try to put you in prison for as long as they possibly can each time?

EM: Well, for a significant period, put it that way. And for what they feel they can get away with without looking too badly.

SH: In other words, they don’t treat this any different than if you were some kind of foreign spy sabotaging their precious missiles, rather than a nun or a former nun protesting in the name of Jesus and the human race.

EM: Yes. I think the way you’re putting it is quite correct and faithful to what we have experienced in the courts, yes.

SH: Well, I’m glad to hear that you’ve got such great, talented lawyers, We would hate to hear that the worst happened here. But it goes to show the level of your commitment, especially having been through this before that you are willing to continue to put your life on the line in this way, it’s incredible.

EM: Well, I’ve had some very, very good examples of people who will not be silent. I have children, I have grandchildren, and it’s impossible for me to think of them and not want to do what I can to make their future a possibility. Those children that are close to me are ways of also feeling for all of our children — all of our children whose lives are really up for grabs, given the way this culture — this society — is being run. And it’s not getting better.

SH: I have to tell you, I’m sure you already know, but in case no one’s reminded you lately, the tales of what you have done have really meant a lot to a lot of people throughout this society and even people who don’t know your name have heard of the Catholics who break into the nuclear weapons facilities to protest before. Everyone knows that’s a thing. And who is it that’s doing it? Priests and nuns are the ones doing it. OK, it’s immediate — it grabs people’s attention. It makes people try to — I mean, if not find out more, at least kind of grapple with the situation here, and I think you have had such an important effect on so many people. I hope you know that, regardless of how this thing plays out, that it has been worth it in a way to those of us who are paying close attention to you.

EM: Thank you for that. I hope for the fidelity to keep on keeping on, so we’ll see how it all goes. But I think that those of us who were part of this most recent action are feeling ready to get to court and to make what presentation we can make. So we’ll see what comes of it.

SH: Great. Well, we’ll be following it as close as we can at Antiwar.com. Again, that’s you and six others: the Kings Bay 7, right?

EM: Yes. Thank you for this, and thank you for your own work, which is really important. Keep on keeping on there, brother, OK?

SH: Thank you so much, Elizabeth, and best of luck to you.

EM: Thank you.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Ramzy Baroud joins the show for an update on Israel and Palestine. He wants to dispel some common misconceptions about Israel, starting with the fact that the country didn’t even exist before 1948, while Palestine has a history that goes back thousands of years. Today, Israel is commonly held to be the sole bastion of civilized liberal democracy in a sea of primitive radical Islamism, but Baroud says this too is incorrect. While Israel might be more advanced by certain metrics, they purposely obfuscate aspects of their government, like institutionalized torture of Palestinians and the history of ethnic cleansing, that we should all recognize as barbaric and medieval.

Discussed on the show:– Advertisement –

• “Palestinians Face Torture in Israeli Administrative Detention” (Antiwar.com Original)
• “71 more Gaza protesters injured, 33 by live fire” (Mondoweiss)

Ramzy Baroud is a US-Arab journalist and is the editor-in-chief of the Palestine Chronicle. He is the author of My Father Was A Freedom Fighter: The Untold Story of Gaza. His new book is The Last Earth: A Palestinian Story. Follow Ramzy on Twitter @RamzyBaroud and read his work at RamzyBaroud.net.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Ben Freeman joins Scott to talk about his new study on the Emirati lobby, which wields enormous power in Washington D.C. The UAE generally has a good reputation in America, usually being associated with glamor, cosmopolitanism, and vast oil wealth. In reality, their government—corrupt like Saudi Arabia—isn’t afraid to use torture and child soldiers, and is every bit as responsible for the genocide in Yemen. The reason for this difference in perception, says Freeman, is that the UAE has a huge lobby that spends millions on their public image, in addition to paying for influence in nearly every congressional office in Washington.

Discussed on the show:– Advertisement –

• The Emirati Lobby: How the UAE Wins in Washington
• “In Yemen’s secret prisons, UAE tortures and US interrogates” (AP News)
• Foreign Agents Registration Act

Ben Freeman is director of the Foreign Influence Transparency Initiative with the Center for International Policy. Read his work at AntiWar.com and follow him on Twitter @BenFreemanDC.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

David Stockman discusses the outrage that has followed President Trump’s movement of a few dozen troops out of northeastern Syria. Stockman is quick to clarify that this is not even a withdrawal of troops, just a relocation from one part of the country into another, safer area. With this much hand-wringing from the mainstream media and the Israel lobby, how could Trump ever actually end a war? Scott and Stockman agree that the situation certainly looks grim, but remind us that Trump really does seem to have a knack for popular politics, meaning that he might realize his best avenue toward a second term would be steadily withdrawing U.S. troops around the world between now and the election.

Discussed on the show:

• “Bravo Donald! A War Washington Might Finally Leave” (Antiwar.com Original)
• “Can Israel trust the U.S. after Syria withdrawal?” (Jerusalem Post)
• “Sen. Lindsey Graham calls troop withdrawal from northern Syria a ‘nightmare for Israel’” (Jewish Telegraphic Agency)
• “Israel uneasy over Trump’s refusal to stand by Kurds” (Reuters)
• “Israelis Watch U.S. Abandon Kurds, and Worry: Who’s Next?” (The New York Times)

David Stockman is the ultimate Washington insider turned iconoclast. He began his career in Washington as a young man and quickly rose through the ranks of the Republican Party to become the Director of the Office of Management and Budget under President Ronald Reagan. After leaving the White House, Stockman had a 20-year career on Wall Street. He is the author of Trumped!, The Triumph of Politics, and his history of the financial crisis, The Great Deformation: The Corruption of Capitalism in America.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Scott interviews Joe Lauria about his recent Consortium News piece calling out the failures of The New Yorker’s Jane Mayer and the rest of the mainstream media’s “investigative journalists” to actually do any investigative journalism with respect to the Ukraine impeachment inquiry. Lauria points out that at the very least, Joe Biden is guilty of a level of nepotism that should be totally unacceptable—and he recently even admitted this himself. But Lauria also reminds us that the Obama administration backed a neo-Nazi coup in Ukraine in 2014, and then placed multiple friendly Americans in high-level government and business positions. Mayer’s “investigation” points none of this out, opting instead to dismiss all concerns as wild conspiracy theory. Like “Russiagate” before, she and the rest of the mainstream media show little interest in discovering the truth behind “Ukrainegate”, happy instead to let their own partisanship get in the way of what should be their jobs.

Discussed on the show:

• “The New Yorker’s Partisan Attempt to Refute Its Claim of Partisan Disinformation on Biden and Ukraine” (Consortium News)
• “The Invention of the Conspiracy Theory on Biden and Ukraine” (The New Yorker)
• The Dark Side: The Inside Story of How the War on Terror Turned Into a War on American Ideals
• Warren Commission
• “Assistant Secretary Nuland Comments on Ukraine” (YouTube)
• “Christopher Steele, the Man Behind the Trump Dossier” (The New Yorker)
• “State Department Official Caught on Tape Saying “F-ck the EU”” (The Atlantic)

Joe Lauria is the editor-in-chief at Consortium News. He is a former UN correspondent and wrote at the Boston Globe and Wall Street Journal. You can follow him on Twitter @unjoe.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.Audio Player

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Matt Taibbi talks about the bizarre origins of the Ukraine impeachment inquiry being conducted in Congress. He carefully explains the distinction between real whistleblowers like Edward Snowden or Chelsea Manning, who risked their lives and freedom to expose genuine atrocities, and this anonymous, possibly coordinated, leak, where the figures in question face little consequence, and in fact have strong political incentive to side with those who might come to power as a result of their actions. Like Scott, Taibbi is no fan of Trump, but he is adamant that we should all criticize the president for what he’s actually doing wrong—like the genocide in Yemen—and not made-up deep state schemes to oust a man that they find personally odious.

Discussed on the show:

• “The Ukrainegate ‘Whisteblower’ Isn’t a Real Whistleblower” (Rolling Stone)
• “We’re in a Permanent Coup” (Substack)

Matt Taibbi is a contributing editor for Rolling Stone and winner of the 2008 National Magazine Award for columns and commentary. He is the author of numerous books, including I Can’t Breathe: A Killing on Bay Street and Insane Clown President: Dispatches from the 2016 Circus. Follow him at taibbi.substack.com or on Twitter @mtaibbi.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: NoDev NoOps NoIT, by Hussein Badakhchani; The War State, by Mike Swanson; WallStreetWindow.com; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Washinton Babylon; Liberty Under Attack Publications; Listen and Think Audio; TheBumperSticker.com; and LibertyStickers.com.

Donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal, or Bitcoin: 1KGye7S3pk7XXJT6TzrbFephGDbdhYznTa.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download