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Scott brings William Van Wagenen on to talk about his new book Creative Chaos: Inside the CIA’s Covert War to Topple the Syrian Government. They talk about why Wagenen was first drawn to the topic before digging into the details we know about covert US policy in Syria, Iraq and the region more broadly.  

Discussed on the show:

• Creative Chaos: Inside the CIA’s Covert War to Topple the Syrian Government by William Van Wagenen
• Why he was drawn to this topic
• “Questions Mount Over Failure to Hit Zarqawi’s Camp” (Wall Street Journal)
• Israel, Winner of the 2003 Iraq Oil War: Undue Influence, Deceptions, and the Neocon Energy Agenda by Gary Vogler
• “The Redirection” (The New Yorker)

William Van Wagenen is the author of Creative Chaos: Inside the CIA’s Covert War to Topple the Syrian Government. He has a BA in German literature From Brigham Young University and an MA in Theological Studies from Harvard Divinity School. You can read his other writings on Syria for the Libertarian Institute here. Follow him on Twitter @wvanwagenen

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: Roberts and Roberts Brokerage Incorporated; Moon Does Artisan Coffee; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; Libertas Bella; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott.

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Daniel Davis talks about the need to fully withdraw U.S. troops from Iraq. He traces the history of terrible decision-making there since 2003, which has encumbered America in an unwinnable war for almost two decades. Worse, we can’t leave. Thanks to political pressure that threatens to blame any president for the temporary chaos that would result from a U.S. absence, no one seems willing to make the effort to pull troops out once and for all. Instead, says Davis, the U.S. will probably leave a small force in Iraq indefinitely, which does nothing to advance American interests, and only leaves our troops at risk of attack.

Discussed on the show:

• “Regardless of How Messy Things Get in Iraq, We Must End the War and Finally, Fully Withdraw” (Military.com)

Daniel Davis did multiple tours in Iraq and Afghanistan during his time in the army. He writes a weekly column for National Interest and is the author of the reports “Dereliction of Duty II: Senior Military Leaders’ Loss of Integrity Wounds Afghan War Effort” and “Go Big or Go Deep: An Analysis of Strategy Options on Afghanistan.” Find him on Twitter @DanielLDavis1.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Scott interviews Dave DeCamp about President Biden’s Russia policy. In an interview with George Stephanopoulos, Biden notably called Putin a “killer;” his administration has also increased sanctions against Russia and instituted some export restrictions in response to its treatment of opposition leader Alexei Navalny. In response to these incidents, Russia has recalled its ambassador to the U.S. DeCamp points out that Biden’s foreign policy isn’t turning out to be all that different than Trump’s—he has just managed to appoint people who are more popular with the political establishment, and so will be more capable of carrying their agenda.

Discussed on the show:

• “Russia Recalls Its US Ambassador After Biden Calls Putin a ‘Killer'” (Antiwar.com)
• “How the US military subverted the Afghan peace agreement to prolong an unpopular war” (The Grayzone)
• “Houthis Clarify: Not Dismissing US Proposal, Peace Talks Still Ongoing” (Antiwar.com)

Dave DeCamp is the assistant news editor of Antiwar.com, follow him on Twitter @decampdave.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Scott Paul discusses the ongoing humanitarian crisis in Yemen, especially in the formerly small town of Marib, where hundreds of thousands of displaced Yemenis who have fled there are now at risk of being caught up in another bloody battleground. Paul stresses that the greatest threats to civilian life during the war in Yemen have always been economic, rather than directly as a result of violent conflict. Before the war, Yemen was already a poor country that relied heavily on imports for basic necessities like food and medicine; thanks to the Saudi blockade, these goods have become increasingly difficult to obtain, with the result that hundreds of thousands of innocent lives have been lost to starvation and deprivation. President Biden’s recent moves to end support for offensive operations are a good start, but until the U.S. and the global community put pressure on Saudi Arabia to end the blockade, the suffering will continue.

Discussed on the show:

• “The Fight for Marib Threatens Millions of Lives in Yemen” (Just Security)
• “How Yemen’s civil war played a role in Africa’s great locust swarm” (The National)
• “The U.S. Is Culpable for Yemen’s Tragedy” (The Atlantic)
• The Education of an Idealist: A Memoir
  
• A Problem from Hell: America and the Age of Genocide
  

Scott Paul leads Oxfam America’s policy advocacy on a number of emergencies and cross-cutting humanitarian issues. He is a frequent media commentator with outlets including the New York Times, Washington Post, Foreign Policy, and Al Jazeera and has testified before Congress. Follow him on Twitter @ScottTPaul.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Daryl Kimball talks about the need to limit the creation and proliferation of nuclear weapons in the world. Today, says Kimball, the U.S. is heading in the wrong direction: a $200 billion plan is in the works to update and expand America’s nuclear arsenal, even though, according to Kimball and all reasonable observers, we already have way more nukes than anyone needs. Most disinterested experts agree that a small arsenal is more than enough to deter other nuclear-armed countries, and that the kind of stockpiles the U.S. and Russia have don’t make anybody any safer. In fact, it greatly increases the chances of a full-scale nuclear war. Because of the global consequences of nuclear fallout, such a war can never be won, and so it must never be fought.

Discussed on the show:

• “Enough Already: No New ICBMs” (Arms Control Association)

Daryl Kimball has been the Executive Director of the Arms Control Association since September 2001. He has written and spoken extensively about nuclear arms control, non-proliferation and weapons production. Follow him on Twitter @DarylGKimball.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Scott talks to Brian McGlinchey about the realities of America’s economic sanctions, which many believe are a more humane alternative to outright war. But this couldn’t be further from the truth. McGlinchey reminds us that in essence, sanctions mean denying basic goods to a country’s civilians in the hope that their government will give in to our demands. This isn’t substantially different from terrorism, which by definition involves acts of violence against civilians for political purposes. Even the supposed exceptions for things like humanitarian aid often don’t pan out in reality, since these days sanctions are largely enforced through America’s influence over the global financial system, which makes it hard to exercise that level of fine-tuning. The result is that children go hungry, hospitals can’t get basic medicine and families are ruined financially, all for an abstract political goal that has nothing to do with the people affected by the sanctions.

Discussed on the show:

• “Advocates of Economic Sanctions Mirror the Morality of al Qaeda” (Stark Realities)
• “Middle-class Iranians resort to buying rotting produce as U.S. sanctions take toll” (Los Angeles Times)
• “Biden Iran envoy boasted of depriving civilians of food, driving up Iranian inequality in sadistic sanctions manual” (The Grayzone)
• “Menendez is defying Biden over Iran because he owes his political life to Israel lobby and Saban” (Mondoweiss)

Brian McGlinchey is a freelance journalist. He started the 28Pages project in 2014 and now writes at substack. Follow his work there, or on Twitter @LibertyMcG.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Gareth Porter talks about the U.S. military’s efforts to sabotage any attempt at leaving Afghanistan. The deal negotiated by the Trump administration made both the conditions and deadlines for withdrawal clear—but almost immediately, the military began claiming that the Taliban was somehow in violation of the agreement, and that America had to stay. Sadly very few people in power are willing to drastically change the situation in Afghanistan, and it looks increasingly likely that the Biden administration will simply try to stay the course.

Discussed on the show:

• “How the US military subverted the Afghan peace agreement to prolong an unpopular war” (The Grayzone)
• “Russia Secretly Offered Afghan Militants Bounties to Kill U.S. Troops, Intelligence Says” (The New York Times)
• “A Secret Accord With the Taliban: When and How the U.S. Would Leave Afghanistan” (The New York Times)
• An Enemy We Created: The Myth of the Taliban-Al Qaeda Merger in Afghanistan
  

Gareth Porter is an investigative historian and journalist on the national security state. He is the author of Manufactured Crisis: The Untold Story of the Iran Nuclear Scare and, with John Kiriakou, The CIA Insider’s Guide to the Iran Crisis. Follow him on Twitter @GarethPorter and listen to Gareth’s previous appearances on the Scott Horton Show.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Scott talks to documentary producer Martin Smith about the subject of his newest project, Hay’at Tahrir al-Sham leader Abu Mohammad al-Jolani. Smith considers Jolani and his fighters to be something of a separate group from al Qaeda and ISIS who should be treated as such—but Scott challenges him with the fact that Jolani, a sworn follower of Ayman al-Zawahiri, is just as guilty of terrorism and war crimes as any al Qaeda leader. Throughout the war in Syria, many in the U.S. have tried to portray Jolani and his fighters as “moderate rebels,” whom we can support in order to overthrow the Assad regime; but Scott reminds us that if anything, Assad is the most moderate option amid a sea of bad actors, given that he has cooperated with America for years and, by regional standards, presides over a fairly stable and tolerant country. In other words, the lesson of two decades of wars in the Middle East should be that no matter how bad things seem, they can always get worse.

Martin Smith has spent 25 years as a producer for PBS’s Frontline documentary series. Follow him on Twitter @Martin28Smith.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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Scott talks to Danny Sjursen about the leaked Biden administration plan to withdraw all U.S. troops from Afghanistan. The document evidently represents the Biden administration’s new take on the deal reached with the Taliban during the Trump administration, which laid out a May 1st deadline for withdrawal. But Sjursen stresses that this plan isn’t really new—in fact, there’s nothing “new” to be done or said about Afghanistan at all. The Kabul government simply doesn’t have widespread control over the country, and the Taliban are in a position of relative strength. Nothing America can do, short of utterly destroying the country, can change the facts on the ground. We should have left years ago, but the best we can do now is leave as soon as possible.

Discussed on the show:

• “The leaked U.S. plan to end the war in Afghanistan” (The Washington Post)

Danny Sjursen is a retired U.S. army major and former history instructor at West Point. He is the author of Ghost Riders of Baghdad: Soldiers, Civilians, and the Myth of the Surge and Patriotic Dissent: America in the Age of Endless War. Follow him on Twitter @SkepticalVet.

This episode of the Scott Horton Show is sponsored by: The War State, by Mike Swanson; Tom Woods’ Liberty Classroom; ExpandDesigns.com/Scott; Photo IQ; Green Mill Supercritical; Zippix Toothpicks; and Listen and Think Audio.

Shop Libertarian Institute merch or donate to the show through Patreon, PayPal or Bitcoin: 1DZBZNJrxUhQhEzgDh7k8JXHXRjYu5tZiG.

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