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I had to stop by the wax museum again and give the finger that FDR We know al-qaeda Zawahiri is supporting the opposition in Syria are we supporting al-qaeda in Syria It's a proud day for America And by God we've kicked Vietnam syndrome once and for all.
Thank you very very These witnesses are trying to simply deny things that just about everybody else except as a fact He came he saw He died, but we ain't killing they arming but we killing them We'd be on CNN like say our name been saying say it three times The meeting of the largest arm is in the history of the world then there's going to be an invasion Aren't you guys introducing the great Philip Weiss he keeps this wonderful website mondo Weiss net Mondo Weiss, and he's got this great group of writers over there and and Phil writes great stuff every day You got to sign up for the morning email That's how I start my morning every morning.
Why are you like this Scott Horton?
Well, I start my morning every morning reading mondo Weiss while I drink my coffee and complain on Twitter about it and it's just the best stuff and it's I think to oversimplify because the Staff of writers there is broader than this but at the core.
This is American liberal Jewish X or anti-zionism Basically, that's what a mondo Weiss represents conscience on the issue of Israel Palestine from a liberal American Jewish point of view so Welcome back to the show I'm so happy to have you here Phil and welcome back to America because you just have are coming back from Israel and or Palestine, correct?
That's right Scott.
I am and Thank you for the the plug too.
I mean, I I agree.
I mean, I I think I came to this just to be To have tip you and and your listeners, you know chiefly as an American, you know And then during the wars and then later discovered that yeah, I'm Jewish I mean the Jewish part is important and the liberal part that's part of it progressive whatever you want to call it But chiefly, you know, there's an American issue that and that's where you and I just have complete agreement And that's why we've been so friendly over the years and why your book is important so important to fool's errand I mean that's about American interest Yeah, you know, it's funny.
I saw an interview with That professor from Northeastern University the terrorism Oh Max Abrams Who's been really great on Syria all this time and I saw an interview of him I think it was on an Israeli news show.
It may not have been an Israeli show It was some news some European news show or something over there in the old world Anyway, and they go yeah, but you know Israel's interest is this time the other thing and Max Abrams is like well Yeah, but I'm an American and so my interest is opposition to al-qaeda of like full stop I don't know what to tell you Israel.
Sorry, but I don't know why you would put it to me that way lady, but I'm from the USA, you know, that's great.
That's great.
Yeah All right.
So where you been and what you see?well, I went to Israel for the new embassy.
I wanted to see the embassy open or get as close as I could to it and Then I wanted to get as close to the Gaza border as I could again.
I had trouble getting close The Israeli officials don't want press mucking around there But I was there on the day that Israel slaughtered 62 people At the Gaza fence and Also shot shot that day they shot 1360 Palestinians another 400 were injured by shrapnel and they say this was they they were absolutely scientific about who they were targeting It's horse manure.
That was you know a historic day in Palestine That massacre it goes in a long series of Israeli massacres But it certainly Reflects the fact that Israel does not have a clue how to deal with its minority or majority non-jewish population and that is Fundamentally the problem with Israel is they've never had a clue what to do with not the non-jewish population except push them out and now they've got a one-state apartheid situation and it's becoming This is the prayerful part on my part.
It's becoming More and more evident to the world that that's the case yeah, you know, I saw a friend on Twitter said the only silver lining of this series of massacres here at the Gaza fence is that the Israelis have accidentally, you know out of context been forced to admit that that's a border This is you know, in other words, this should be independent territory, but it's not yeah Yeah, yeah if they had had that they should have grabbed the two-state solution when they had a chance and They didn't they wanted they were greedy.
They wanted more land with fewer Palestinians on it and So now they control the entire territory between the river and the sea it is one state Let's just acknowledge that more and more realists in America are acknowledging.
It's one state.
It's apartheid They got what they wanted.
They don't believe in democracy.
They believe in the Jewish state.
So But you know and and I think that when your friend speaks of the silver lining Let's I want to emphasize the fact that there are a lot of brave brave people in Gaza who dared to go up to that fence and dared to demand their right to return to their villages and in doing so expose themselves to murderous violence and I couldn't do that and By doing that they have I think affected world opinion affected the American view of this conflict and maybe woken up some Jews to who I believe are so crucial to Changing the American understanding of this well, so I guess I'm not as familiar about what all was said and negotiated during the 1970s, you know between 67 and 79 but at Camp David part of the deal was in making peace with Egypt and Jordan there I think it was both right was that they were gonna allow for there to be an independent Palestinian state as well and then you had I don't know if Oslo was supposedly on that same chain of peace process or also was supposed to be a Fresh new start, but this was what they all agreed that they would work on in In was in 1992 there.
So what's the problem?well, you're right that Sadat only signed the Camp David Accords because There was Palestinian language in there.
There was Palestinian autonomy I believe was what the the Israelis whittled it down to but that was a commitment that he had to have before he would normalize his relations with Israel Jordan, I think said the same thing later in in the 90s, but yeah, I mean Oslo's been on Oslo was on the table since Palestinians made it as a central concession in 1988 saying that they would accept a state indicating they would accept a state on 22% of historical Palestine and so That affirmation was reaffirmed by the Arab states in 2000 So from 1988 to 2000 you had a very firm commitment from the Palestinian era and Arab states Palestinian era and Arab side that they wanted this conflict to end with a Palestinian sovereignty and Israel is you know, I mean we all can see what's happened.
Israel has just continued to build settlements inside the West Bank and East Jerusalem, and so that's occupied that Golan is occupied.
They want they want the whole land That's just that's what they want.
They got it.
The government coalition is dominated now by Right-wing and religious parties that are committed to one Israel They even speak of tearing down the Al-Aqsa Mosque some of them these crazies and putting up a third temple so the That is the greatest Achievement, I think of Israel in the West is that it is hoodwinked The American mainstream about the true nature of of their designs in the state Americans have very little idea how right-wing Israel is and you're not talking about TV brainwashed braindead Americans you're talking about Washington DC and the deals they've made with the people who are in charge of this place here Yeah, yeah, definitely in Washington that's the place where there should be some awareness and you know, you have the Israel lobby working 24-7 to give Israel a beautiful image in in Washington and to say we just want peace and it's just not true and That seems to me is the miracle, you know people talk about the miracle of Israel.
The miracle is Hasbro the miracle is the brainwashing that's happened over here to tell us to Assert that this is a liberal democracy or a quote Jewish democracy.
What's a Jewish democracy, you know?
In Pakistan there, you know, that's a Muslim state and you know You have to you can't eat in public during Ramadan right now.
It's all straightforward in Israel.
It's the same kind of business It's intolerance towards any minority.
So It's a it's a religious state and it's not a democracy Well, and you know, I try to be as generous as I can to you know The the other side's point of view when it comes to you know The American people and what they believe and I really don't have any other option but to agree with what you said that They really just don't understand it at all.
I mean when I hear the arguments for Israel here, it's always as though Palestine is the country next door that is attempting to invade and attack Israel and you know if Mexico sent their hordes to invade the United States like this We would have to attack Mexico or whatever, even though that's a really poor analogy, you know This is an Indian reservation.
It's not Mexico, you know, it's not that country next door.
It's not Jordan These Palestinians they lost their war and were conquered in 1967 and yet but the other side of this argument doesn't understand that they don't ever say look I know that it's an occupation ever since 67 in this net.
However, no, there's no Acknowledgement of the reality of situation at all They really believe that the Palestinians are the dominant threatening force or at least the threatening one and that poor little Israel's just trying to defend themselves from aggression, right but I mean, I guess I we arrive at a question of who's to blame and you know, I would point out that even on like National Public Radio in the last couple of days they refer to Hamas as this horrible threat to America and Why do people believe this stuff, you know, can we blame the Israel lobby entirely?
Yeah, I think we can blame them largely, but there's also a degree of you know the ignorance in our country about international affairs is pretty profound and You know American them I don't know the American people have done made some pretty big foreign policy mistakes misled by their leaders, but they've gone along with a lot of this stuff and You know it fills me I guess I have some despair about the ability to change public opinion on this stuff I mean the American people voted for George W Bush in 2004.
How much information did you need about how incompetent that guy was?
Yeah, well, but look at who he was up against Yeah, they do happen well now so but this brings up You know some of the stuff that you've been writing about lately that actually is pretty optimistic I've really liked to see where you're saying that you think that Trump's nature and his alliance with Adelson and Netanyahu and his actions on Jerusalem and on the Iran deal Have really helped to make Israel much more of a partisan issue and so talk a little bit about that because I think that if that's really true then maybe there's a little bit of you know some Cracks in the narrative that can You know the common narrative can be shown here, too.
If people have to fight about it They're gonna have to explain their position a little bit.
You know yeah I mean and to be fair to the American people I think out there There are a lot.
There are a lot of people who understand how Oppressive Israel is you know I run into people all the time Ordinary people like myself and they don't have a lot of information They have enough to know that Israel is completely out of line And it is the elites and it is the political establishment that is driving the narrative here now The great thing is that in the past the Israel lobby had a policy that we are absolutely bipartisan We work on both parties and so that whoever gets into power There is no daylight between the United States and Israel's government well that lob that that bipartisan you know kind of wallpaper and fence post defense post control of the political establishment is changing and breaking up a little because Trump is so aligned with Netanyahu that and the right wing of Israel that the left Wing of the Israel lobby in the United States is saying we don't like Trump.
We don't like these policies We don't know how we feel about the embassy and even the Gaza thing well.
They may have killed too many people They were unrestrained so right now you have a right wing lobby Which is all for Israel all the way in the Republican Party and Trump, and you have a left-wing lobby That is saying well Israel needs to pull back at settlements a little and grab the two-state solution while it can You know because that's the only thing that will save Israel, so you have the lobby split and at each other's throats and There's hope that once that fight begins in earnest and people actually start to argue about Israel remember in 2016 the Largest criticism we had of Israel and the whole political process Was when Bernie Sanders said in the New York primary against Hillary Clinton?
Sometimes we have to be able to say that Netanyahu is not always right, you know, so you had a sort of a You know hushed criticism of Israel by Bernie Sanders that was brave But that's where it ended Hillary to end and Trump did not disagree over Israel this time In this cycle, there is a hope that Democrats on the progressive left will be saying hey What the heck is it with this Israel?
We do not support this.
This is not American values We are spending too much of American capital both in terms of actual material resources and our image around the world on this apartheid state we say no and so I Anticipate that some candidates on the Democratic left will say that and that in 2020 It might even be an issue in the presidential race.
So slowly those cracks are appearing Are they gonna help save Palestinian lives?
Are they gonna help save the two-state solution?
I don't think so I think it's a really bad time for Palestinians right now A friend of mine wrote me last night Look at the plans for the Museum of Tolerance in Jerusalem that some big Israel lobby organization is building on my grand great grandfather's grave a Muslim cemetery in Jerusalem is the site of the seaman the Seaman reason Simon Wiesenthal centers a Museum of Tolerance so complete intolerance on the part of Israel towards its Muslim and Palestinian citizens and It just keeps getting worse.
I mean, I know that example too.
It sounds like something just made up I remember when I first read about that years ago where they literally bulldozed the cemetery This at least hundreds years old cemetery East Jerusalem to build a Museum of Tolerance in other words a museum of Israeli Jewish victim hood Right, and he's Jerusalem on Palestinian on it on a confiscated Palestinian graveyard Monument to boohoo for us.
Yeah, that's it.
And I would say it is in West Jerusalem It's on the other side of the Green Line, but big deal, you know, okay, I'm sadder.
No, but yeah It ain't their cemetery to bulldoze.
That's for sure.
Yeah, and and those people don't count It's because those people don't count don't say it's democracy.
Those people have no political power So yeah, and it's boohoo for us.
I mean, there's a Museum of Tolerance How about a little bit of tolerance for people who are Palestinian Christians and Muslims and actually that's their property How about some tolerance for them?
Yes, exactly Exactly You know Scott the one other thing though I'd say about that when we were talking about the lobby the one good piece of news or another interesting piece of news that is coming on to the Landscape right now is that you may have seen that the Muller?
Investigation is starting to look into other foreign influences on the election and on the political parties besides this Big deal Russian whatever it was meddling who knows what the heck it was and you know Saw that story, but I'll tell you that's going nowhere, man The Russian one or the Israeli one?
Yeah, they're not gonna go that way But I was surprised to see that in The New York Times though that yeah, wait, so wait I'm sorry.
Actually now that now that you mentioned it.
Let me make sure I got this right cuz I Guess I'm not sure did the story say that the Mueller investigation is looking at the Israel angle or just that that was one of The things that was brought to their attention or something Yeah, I think that you your cynicism is absolutely correct and they're not going to do anything with it But just as the last piece of Russian influence that was documented which was Mike Flynn's lying to the FBI about what he had Done in during the transition in 2016 just as that lie exposed Israel's influence Mike Flynn was lying about the fact that he was trying to get the Russians to sandbag that Anti-settlements resolution at the UN Security Council So Israel's influence was patent then Israel's influence is again patent in the latest Disclosures about what Mueller's looking into now as you say, he's not going to touch the Israel influence part but it's clear that this guy Elliot Broidy who's a You know a giant fundraiser on the Republican side and had access to the White House Broidy's game was Working was sort of influence peddling with Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates He was about to make millions on a contract to represent them In why in Washington because he has and to demonize Qatar.
Well, that was his game But this is a guy who's Broidy who's worked for Israel Who's been an Israel lobbyist for a long time has been involved with the Republican Jewish coalition Which is only concerned with Israel an organization that has connections to Sheldon Adelson an organization whose Head Norm Coleman just accepted the 30 million dollar donation from Adelson to the Congressional Leadership Fund so you have this kind of organization Republican Jewish coalition which supports Israel it which is basically An Israel lobby front I mean is Israel lobby organization in Washington that is sort of the clearinghouse for a lot of influence on the Trump administration and Broidy of former, you know finance guy with the RNC and a board member of the Republican Jewish coalition is Under the scopes of Mueller for Influence peddling with Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, but he's obviously doing it for Israel, too So whether that will ever become an issue politically You know, we can hope I doubt of course, it will be criminalized in any fashion Hey, let me tell you about the sponsors of this show.
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No IT It's by Hussain Badak Chani, and it's about how to run your business right in a libertarian way Liberty stickers calm I Guess Rick didn't like the great new website, so we'll have to wait someday.
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I don't know And Tom was Liberty classroom if you like learning things I'll get a commission if you sign up by way the link on my website And listen if you want a new and the reason my website is down is my own broken servers But if you want a new good-looking website like the one I do have when it's up and running at Scott Horton org Then check out expand designs calm Scott expand designs Calm Scott, and you will save 500 bucks on your new website now so I Guess when it comes to you know on the American political side here in terms of opinion changing Cuz I think you know like you said, and I think this is really true starting in 2014 Maybe it had already started to be true, but certainly in the 2014 slaughter the Palestinians finally got to have their you know 3g camera phone pictures Tweeted and the American people got to see their side of the story for the first time ever and took their side You know barely, but still that seemed to be like a real change there, and you know there's a generational change and all these things but I'm interested in this split in the Democratic Party because the way you've characterized it a lot of times Which seems pretty fair to me is that it's the older and the moneyed interest behind the Democratic Party who are Basically might as well be Sheldon Adelson themselves versus yeah, basically all the rank-and-file Democratic voters Yeah, you know all the political activists the progressives and the liberal even the liberals But especially the progressives and the those to the further left than them And this even came down was it in 2012 in LA where they had this big fight where the pro-palestinian Vote obviously the eyes have it And they just the leadership just lied up there and pretended that the nays had won on this resolution, right?
There is a change coming there you think huh?
Yeah well I mean I think that look for from time immemorial for the last 30 years the progressive elements of the Democratic Party and Here I would cite especially the black caucus left the hard left and You know people of color have been on the palestinian side and In the Democratic base what has kept them from actually?
Getting their views into the platform.
I mean you see the platform is a fluid document on things like You know freedom of transgender Individuals on gay rights generally on Feminist issues on the death penalty the Democrats have been The death penalty the Democratic Party reflects its base on those issues on this issue It never has and the reason is American Jews American Jews are very important in the Democratic Party And they're very important as fundraisers in the Democratic Party at jay street a couple of years ago emily's list you know, which is gets democratic candidates to Up to speed and helps recruit them and a leader of emily's list said the the amount of jewish money in Democratic side is gigantic and jj goldberger the forward says it's shocking if you knew how much uh of the leading money inside the the the The most important uh donors inside the democratic party are jewish so That's a reality and so what I hope for is a generate what we're seeing is a generational shift where older jews are wed to zionism because of the holocaust or because of Uh, that was the jewish religion was zionism in the last 50 years and young jews are saying no mass And so that I think is the great change that's happening That's the shift we're seeing and that is going to free the demo that is going to end this break inside the democratic party on supporting palestinian rights and we see uh I mean increasingly that's what my website In some ways or I reflect is that shift inside jewish opinion where the young people are saying?
Hey, this is outrageous.
We don't feel that we are one.
They say I have a book I'm looking at a book right on my bookshelves right now by melvin yarovsky that characterized the jewish view of israel And american jews through the 70s the 80s the 90s 2000 we are one young jews don't feel that way And so yes, i'm parochial.
Uh, you know, we always have this conversation on the show and um, Some viewers or listeners are sometimes critical of me for being so parochial Uh and and sectarian and and looking at the jewish community is so important But I do so because I really think that's where the power is Uh to politicize this question on the right it maybe it's a different question Maybe you have the evangelicals I accept that or who are a factor but sheldon adelson's a bigger factor So even there uh jews are very important on the right and so I chronicle every jot and tittle of change inside the american jewish community and I think it's happening and I think it's going to Free up our political process.
Yeah, and look I mean for people who Are skeptical or coming at this from a much more pro-israel point of view, right?these are not anti-semitic tropes or anything sheldon adelson is a real man with a real pile of money and with Well, tell us about sheldon adelson and and what he what you know about what he thinks about israel Well, sheldon adelson has said I would I I wish I hadn't served in the american army I wish I had served in the israeli army Uh, he has said uh That obama should nuke iran.
He said I was sitting there and what was it?
2015 or 2014 at uh, yeshiva university in new york when he said we ought to Fire a nuclear bomb at iran and say you keep this up and we're going to level your do it in the desert first Then we'll do it in your cities.
So this and um in 2000 uh sheldon adelson Was outraged by the peace process and um was involved in an organization called one jerusalem And gave a whole lot of money to the republican party and to george w bush and bush Took his policy from sheldon adelson in 2000 And that's why there were so many neoconservatives in his administration.
One reason was that he He needed the money from sheldon adelson.
And why is john bolton now our national security advisor?
He's a favorite of sheldon adelson and sheldon adelson Just cut a check for 30 million dollars to the congressional leadership fund on the republican side.
He handed it to norm.
Coleman Uh, but paul ryan was there when uh, when the deal went down, but he had to hand the check To uh, norm coleman, I guess to preserve some uh official, uh niceties But so this man does not want jerusalem divided and lo jerusalem is not divided He wanted the embassy moved the embassy's been moved.
I think we really have to regard our transactional president donald trump As working very well with a very transactional guy the casino mogul sheldon adelson and adelson is getting what he wanted And uh the failure to point this out On the front page of the new york times or front page of the washington post And the claims that the iran deal was destroyed because of um Uh trump's rivalry with obama surely a factor but uh that that that that mainstream analysts leave out the fact that sheldon adelson is Trying to save the republican party in the coming midterm elections, which is obviously crucial to donald trump That's the biggest factor involved.
Well, and of course I mean one might argue that Hey, listen, he donates so much because he wants congress to outlaw every form of gambling that competes with his casinos, of course Because he's a rent seeker just like the rest of these people, you know, yeah, I don't mean jews.
I mean rich businessmen of all uh backgrounds and so, uh You know, but that's not really it right?
He doesn't he he's not just some guy with an opinion about nuking iran But this is where his politics lie and this is what he lobbies for and has at the center of his interest alongside outlawing Online gambling and whatever else he can right?
Yeah, I mean, I haven't even looked into his gambling interest that much because obviously it's there But when the media only talk about the gambling interest, they're overlooking what is clearly front and center to him I mean you watch interviews with this guy.
He believes in the the the need for israel He believes in the ideals of israel, he believes that israel is a great democracy These are things he genuinely believes he's devoted to israel.
And so you got to take him at his word and so and he has the whole um kind of uh alarmist view of Of sort of jewish existence that uh helped bring about the state of israel in the first place and that uh fostered the rise of the israel lobby, he really thinks that Uh, there's existential threats to israel from iran.
Israel has 200 nuclear weapons.
Iran has none I mean He just believes the hype and the propaganda and he's very close to netanyahu Who of course has manipulated the united united states to a fairly well and I you know That's where the foreign policy is being made right now on this question It's being you know, i've even had israelis email me before and say, you know, it's your fault We're stuck with netanyahu anyway, because it's americans who bankroll lakud It's americans who bankroll it's sheldon adelson who bankrolls this newspaper That's the most widely read newspaper in israel that he just gives away for free It takes it as a loss to promote lakud that if foreigners meaning american diaspora jews Were not allowed to intervene in israeli elections things might be different and better That's true.
Although, you know, I just have to say scott.
I I mean this goes to theories of public opinion again on which i'm pretty cynical, but I was just in israel and You know, I interviewed people on the street about the slaughter the day that they shot, you know, they shoot 1360 people killing 60 of them, you know with live fire unarmed demonstrators And I interviewed israelis on the street in jerusalem about this and you know, 20 people refuse to talk They don't trust the international media.
I get that 20 talk to me and Just every one of them was for this Everyone said we did the right thing and I almost got thrown out of my I was in an airbnb And a woman half my age who was my host suddenly starts yelling at me that I hate myself To and I don't have the full picture to be criticizing israel these people are fully behind a policy of massacring unarmed protesters and You know i'd like to blame sheldon adelson for that i'd love to blame americans bankrolling netanyahu, but That society is like a cult.
It's like a right-wing militarist sparta cult and for 70 years it has not been able to figure out its palestinian problem And it's the result has been that these people are lesser human beings.
They don't count We're going to build museums of tolerance on their graveyards and you know Screw off, you know what when when max blumenthal our mutual friend max blumenthal was over there Uh writing goliath back years ago I remember interviewing him and he was just this society's so far gone You have no idea the entire place is far to the right of what we call republicans in our culture man there Yes, and like you said too I think he may have even used the c-word cult For the mindset there that worse than the worst kind of right-wing kooks here That's interesting and and right-wing kooks come in pretty kooky flavors here now one more thing real quick and i'm sorry I know you gotta go but can you talk a little bit about david rothkopp?
This is a guy who's the former editor of foreign policy.com And I know him as being kind of a frustrating center-right hillary yite on the iran deal Which I wish he had supported better and things like this but you have some quotes of this guy and you seem to think that this he's really a thermometer for You know elite intellectual kind of centrist Um opinion on this issue and jewish opinion Jewish too.
Yeah, I mean obviously this guy's an elite leader in any case, uh, regardless of his religion But and this is a guy, you know, he he was uh indoctrinated in the zionist cause as a young man His roommate was michael oran at columbia many many years ago Michael oran the propagandist for israel and their ambassador a guy who moved from the united states To israel because he felt he was unsafe in the united states anti-semitism was going to hurt him.
Well David rothkopf, uh, and is someone also who trashed walton miersheimer in the worst way when they published in 2006 And what we've seen from him over the recent recent years are more and more anti-zionist statements about What is the jewish state doing?
Why is the jewish state doing this and disavowing a lot of what israel has done and he was outraged as any human being should be by israel's treatment of unarmed demonstrator, uh protesters and Said, uh, yeah, they were threatening the fence weren't there alternatives to shooting them with live fire shooting 1400 people So I you know, that's I mean Should we be congratulating someone for reaching those conclusions?
Of course not I mean, these are obvious conclusions any human being should reach them, but I think that it's significant that rothkopf Uh who is in again in the mainstream a lot of people follow him in the establishment and uh, He's he's had it.
I I you see more and more Sort of he's giving up on the jewish state and I don't I would be I wouldn't be surprised if he declares himself to be an anti-zionist soon And again, I think that's important that we have this ideology That is in a decadent phase it's worse than what communism had become I mean in terms of uh It's uh being discredited.
Um communism was in the 50s.
Um, you know, it was a worn-out ideology It had failed it may have been great on paper.
Zionism has completely failed in um, In delivering on what it said it was going to do And uh, I think that's more and more evident to anyone who's fair-minded including you and me Yeah, it's just like my old buddy.
Darren's bumper sticker used to say, uh denial keeps me loyal And once you break through that go ahead.
Wow I don't know take a tab of acid or something do something to kind of think of things different for a minute And you'll see right through and things got to change It can't be like this and and more and more people are definitely coming around and and to a great degree in this society That's because of your great work phil.
So thank you again But scott one quick question of you before we go.
Um You know in the you know, those word clouds they do on the internet that shows what emphasis stuff has and you know, and uh Sure.
Yeah, you know bigger words smaller words.
It's a big cloud of words How in in your world view of american?
Well in your view of american foreign policy You look at a lot of factors.
How important do you think and you know, you get you put me on generously, you know Every couple months or so or every few months When something has happened, but how important to you is israel palestine in terms of american foreign policy?
I mean you have a broader i've told me in my own opinion I mean, I think it's god.
It's just the hugest thorn in the side of everything man.
It's horrible You know and of course because of israel's role in america's problems with iran, too You know, I know you know that back in the 1990s We could we didn't have to have the dual containment policy from bases in saudi arabia provoking bin laden night terrorist attacks against the u.s We could have made peace with saddam and with the ayatollah in the 1990s and just said well, whatever We're the dominant faction around here and you guys are going to have to find a way to get along in our order And they would have accepted that in circa 1993.
Why not?
But instead the policy, you know martin indic and all the israel lobbies all the guys from winnip In bill clinton's government said no sir.
We got to stay in saudi to dual contain these two enemy states It's crazy, you know, yeah, and I could go on and on and on To me, it's everything and it's and look it's why ramsey yusuf attacked the world trade center And it's why his uncle khalid sheikh muhammad attacked the world trade center.
How about that for an answer beautiful, man?
Thank you for that.
I appreciate it.
And I know you've pointed that out to me before And I thank you for reminding me.
Yeah, and you know what honestly man Look at what we're going through right now with this jerusalem thing.
I mean, this is a huge thing I'm in al-zawahiri just put out, you know, the butcher of new york city who's still on the loose out there Hiding in a basement in pakistan somewhere I guess just put out a podcast the other day You know rally all forces and this and that and the other thing what a great talking point for the enemy as america's given what was supposed to be an international city where you know, it was I was just reading about this the other day where It would have uh, it would be binational in terms of the national control over it But would it have one municipal non-sectarian government to be in charge of the city kind of thing?
Let uh, jewish israeli and a palestinian muslim Trade places or whatever every few years something to make it work like that Which would have been fair and would have worked out because after all these holy sites are holy to um, You know christians jews and muslims all together So yeah, yeah, and why not share it and get along instead of trying to keep it from each other, you know No, we will not have sovereignty over the holy basin bs Yeah, um, and you know, you mentioned this earlier and it sounds crazy But this is really a thing and I don't know how strong it is in israeli politics, right?but this is a thing where there's a certain movement that wants to Destroy the al-aqsa mosque and build the third temple and start sacrificing animals right which would be world war at that point Yeah, I don't think I think the likelihood of that is um far less than even a war with iran, I mean but Which you know, you don't think it's gonna happen No, I mean, I agree with that too.
I it seems to be kind of a winger issue But then again the winners seem to be running things.
So I don't know that's right.
Yeah.
I mean, it's funny I mean there are members of knesset on the members of their parliament on the right wing side who are dedicated to that cause Now they're just a few and they're wingnuts and they don't and netanyahu keeps them at a distance I believe but Yeah, I mean, I mean there's some hagiites, you know, some some right-wing evangelicals in america who are really into this, too um You know, there was a there was a column by romando back years ago Just romano called beware the red heifer where these texas ranchers were trying to genetically engineer a pure red heifer so that that would be the loophole in the prophecy where either you have to wait around for jesus to come back or if you have a red heifer you can go ahead and Cheat and start going now, right?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
That's great And that place would be dripping with blood, you know animal sacrifice as you said, can you imagine jesus anyway?
Yeah, okay I better let you go I know you have to go but I love talking with you phil and I love all your work and and i'm a huge fan of All your guys, too Okay.
Thanks phil.
Appreciate it.
Okay All right, you guys that's the great philip weiss.
He's at mondo weiss.net mondo weiss.net The mondo weiss blog and follow him on twitter phil weiss on twitter and also mondo weiss as well All right, so you guys know the deal, uh foolsaron.us for the book scott.
Horton.org and youtube.com Scott horton show for all the interviews 4,500 of them now going back to 2003 for you there Read what I want you to read at anti-war.com and at libertarian institute.org And follow me on twitter at scott horton show, thanks
