11/11/15 – Ray McGovern – The Scott Horton Show

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Okay, anyway, running late, but now to our good friend Ray McGovern.
He's writing at consortiumnews.com.
He used to be a CIA analyst for 27 years.
Now he's the co-founder of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, which often writes memos to the president about what he ought to stop doing.
And that's this president and the one before him too.
I don't know if they go back all the way to Clinton years.
Anyway, um, so he's a piece of Nick.
He works, uh, or not works, but, um, he gives speeches through an organization called Tell the Word, which you can look up.
They're based in DC, a church group, and they'll have him out to give a speech about peace to you and yours over there.
And, uh, did I say writes for consortiumnews.com?
And this one's very long and very interesting.
Bush 41, that is H.W. Bush, that is senior, finally speaks up on the Iraq war.
And you know what?
I should remember how young this audience is.
Bush senior was president from 1989 through 1993.
Everybody.
Okay, good.
Hey, welcome to the show.
How are you doing, Ray?
Good, Scott.
And you?
I'm doing good.
Very happy to have you here.
Very happy to, uh, read this article and learn a lot of the things that I learned in here about, uh, uh, well, the march to war in, uh, 2002 and 2003 into the current chapter of America's Middle Eastern madness there.
And now, um, so the thing of it is, is that H.W. Bush just made news because in his new book coming out that the New York times got their hands on, he says, you know, Cheney and Rumsfeld ruined my son's presidency, but yeah, of course it is his fault for hiring them and doing what they said, but still it is their fault.
And everybody knows that that's absolutely correct in both senses there.
But, uh, you had quite a reaction here and really got into telling the story about the split between the father and the son and the split for that matter, between the oil men and the neocons when it came to Iraq war two.
So do tell sir, please.
Well, Scott, that's a good lead in, uh, the, uh, the fact that, uh, Bush, the elder decided to, uh, uh, let it all hang out with his biographer, John Meacham in a book that I get tomorrow at the quickest I could get it.
Uh, it's sort of, uh, been released to the times and other, uh, you know, Hoya or our story people, the, uh, what my grandmother used to call the upper crust.
Um, um, but there was enough released in these reports to really give me a very sad flashback.
Uh, let me explain.
Um, when George W. Bush came into office and, you know, right after nine 11, when he had a chance to play to our best or our worst emotions and chose the latter, um, it was clear that the people that he had brought into office were really egging him on to war.
Now that was first and foremost Cheney.
Everybody could see that and the Rumsfeld and there are a whole bunch of other people, the so-called neocons, Paul Wolfowitz, for example, who at last mentioned has been advising Bush's campaign.
Yeah, he was, uh, he was lusting for war against Iraq.
So, uh, what I did since, uh, well, uh, George H. W. Bush was a friend of mine.
Okay.
I used to brief him.
I worked directly under him when he was head of the CIA.
And after he and I both left government, uh, we had a correspondence.
Uh, he's a very congenial person.
And when you're friends, you exchange emails or in our case, it was hard, hard copy, uh, uh, letters.
And I took, I took it so seriously in early January of 2003, when it was very clear that we were going to go to war.
I wrote him a note and I said, uh, you know, Mr. Vice, Mr. President, uh, you know, I'm emboldened by the memories we had together to, to ask you privately, if you could just, just tell, tell your son about the crazies.
Now for your audience, they need to know who the crazies are.
Uh, they're the ones I just mentioned that Richard Pearls, the Paul Wolfowitz's, the ones that they're called neocons.
And one definition of neocon is, is for those who cannot really see any separation between the U S interests and those of Israel.
Uh, Israel was also applauding us for going to war against Iraq.
So those are the folks that, uh, that George HW Bush, the elder had to contend with.
And I watched them.
Okay.
Now he couldn't fire them, uh, because they were, you know, he, he would incurred would have incurred the wrath of what in those days, uh, passed for the, for the tea party people, the real hardline folks.
And he didn't want to have a stir up with the Republican.
So he kept them in places in the Pentagon and elsewhere where they couldn't get us into major, major trouble.
Okay.
Uh, he had James Baker, his secretary of state, he had Brett Scowcroft, a very experienced national security advisor.
And they, they were the ones that were calling the shots and they succeeded in keeping the Wolfowitz's and the pearls and the others, uh, down in the bowels of the Pentagon and elsewhere.
So why, why all this background?
Well, when Bush, Bush, when W came in and he brought these guys with him.
And, uh, not only that, but after watching this for almost a year, I decided, you know, Hey, McGovern, you have this personal relationship with, uh, with the guy's father, for God's sake.
Uh, yeah.
You run a risk of losing this personal relationship.
We're talking about war here.
Okay.
Yeah.
All right.
Now hold it right there.
I hate to do this, but we're going to do like the cliffhanger at the commercial break.
When we get back, we're going to find out, uh, what George H. W. Bush said in his response to Ray McGovern.
This is a breaking story right here on the show today.
The first, I think anybody's ever heard this publicly about Ray's attempt to get George H. W. Bush to speak out against Iraq war two before it was too late.
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All right, you guys welcome back to the show.
It's armistice day 2015 here doing the Scott Horton show.
And I've got an exclusive for you.
I'm talking with Ray McGovern, former CIA analyst for 27 years.
He was the morning briefer for vice president George H. W. Bush in the Ronald Reagan years, and had a personal friendship with him on some level.
And we all know we remember the history, don't we, guys, everybody that in 2002, Ray and his merry band of veteran intelligence professionals for sanity were desperately putting out press releases memos contradicting the fake intelligence, saying that no, Saddam did not just receive a bunch of weapons of mass destruction as manna from heaven, because, and we know what he doesn't have from the last 10 years of inspections.
So this is a bunch of lies, and we got to try to stop it.
And they really did their very best led by Ray at the time to do so.
But now so Ray is telling the story of how he took advantage of his personal relationship with former President George H. W. Bush and wrote him a letter in, I think he said, very early 2003, before the war, saying, Mr. President, don't you think you ought to at least educate your son about who the crazies are?
Right?
Because George W. Bush was probably as confused as every Democrat in the country, trying to tell one kind of Republican from another.
And I mean, hell, everybody thought it was James Baker and the oil men wanted the war all along.
In the first place, whoever heard of a neo conservative, whoever knew that there was a faction of 40 men in DC and New York who put the interests of a foreign power first and win, and can win like this when they're allied with the Vice President, etc.
It's clear.
And Andrew Coburn has reported that junior never even asked senior what is a neocon until 2006.
Ray, six, it's a good thing I don't have a gun on my shoot myself in the head.
He didn't even ask.
And even then, Andrew Coburn, the way he reports it is, senior merely said to him, who or what?
And so he said, what?
And senior said, Israel, both of these idiots, like they can't even have a conversation at all.
Like senior can't even take the time to say it's Pearl and them.
Junior, come on, dummy.
You know, I don't know.
So go ahead.
Tell your story.
I'm sorry I'm talking so much, but go ahead and tell the story of what you wrote in this letter to Bush senior here.
Well, I want to make it very clear that I did take advantage, as you put it, of our friendship that is between the elder Bush and me to try to warn him about what was going on.
Now, it's really important for me that people realize that I'm not going to divulge or even talk about in any way the way we got together when I briefed him every other morning on the president's daily brief.
That is sacrosanct.
I'm never going to release any information from that because obviously I don't want to prejudice things for my successors.
There should be a complete confidentiality there.
So I'm not betraying any secrets from that time.
What I'm saying is that we were friends.
When my youngest son graduated from William and Mary, he was this, George H. W. Bush was the main speaker, and he had us over to where we were staying, my wife and Joseph, my son, and it was for half an hour.
We had a wonderful meeting.
That was after he was president.
That was 20 years ago.
That was after I had quit as well.
So what I did was get very upset with the fact that, number one, people like Richard Perle were threatening to use nuclear weapons on Iraq.
Now, I kid you not, go back to the record, that's what they were saying.
I said, my God, these people really deserve the label crazies.
So I did write this letter.
It was early January 2003.
I said that I'm really upset with the cavalier way that the Perles of this world, I call them the Perles of the Pentagon, how they're promoting the use of nuclear weapons as an acceptable option on Iran.
I mean, on Iraq.
Freudian slip here.
I said, the fact that these people have the president's ear, it was really scary, downright scary, I said, and I think he needs to know why you exercise such care to keep them at arm's length.
You know, they're also leaning all over my former colleagues, CIA analysts, to make sure their analysis will, quote, justify, end quote, this war.
You know what, that's like you ahead of the CIA.
That's also unacceptable.
And so I said, you know, I've become so upset about this that I've become, I've started to publish op-ed pieces, and we're about to establish veteran intelligence professionals for sanity to speak out on these things.
And so I'm going to...
No, then I got the date wrong.
You wrote this letter in early 2002, not early 2003.
No, it was early, did I say 2002?
It was early 2003, actually.
Oh, well, no, but you created veteran intelligence professionals for sanity before that in 2002, didn't you?
Well, it actually didn't take formal shape until January of 2003.
Oh, I'm sorry, Ray.
I'm confused and interrupting.
Please go ahead.
No, we were just exchanging a lot of emails and giving each other sanity checks all throughout 2002.
In 2003, we decided to incorporate ourselves, so to speak.
And our first memo was on the day that Colin Powell made that speech at the UN.
So suffice it to say that I had been writing, and I enclosed four of my op-eds.
Now, these were not in the New York Times or the Washington Post, ha, ha, ha.
They were in, like, the San Francisco Examiner or the Charlotte Observer or the Hartford Current or the Miami Herald.
These were, now, no slouch newspapers, but hardly, you know, hardly the tools of the people running things.
So one thing I call this specific attention to was when I had just done, what, one week before on January 3, it was in the Charlotte Observer, and it talked about Vietnam and how LBJ buffaloed.
LBJ intimidated everyone into going up to Congress to sell the Tonkin Gulf Resolution.
Now, for your listeners who are a little younger, there was a one real incident in the Tonkin Gulf where the North Vietnamese took shots at our destroyers, and then there was a contrived incident two days later.
The contrived one was used to justify the so-called Tonkin Gulf Resolution, which in turn, quote, justified, end quote, the war in Vietnam for the next many years, okay?
So what happened?
When we told McGeorge Bundy, this National Security Advisor, that it was all bogus, that the NSA had it all screwed up, that there was no attack on the 4th of August, LBJ comes in.
Now, how do I know this?
I know this because when McNamara wrote that book, there used to be a McNeil-Lehrer report, and they used to ask real questions then.
So they had McGeorge Bundy, and they had others, McNamara, around the table.
And they said, well, what happened that morning, that next morning?
You know it was a bogus attack.
And McGeorge Bundy says, well, the president came in, and he's a very big guy.
And he said, well, okay, now we can settle that resolution up on the hill.
Go up there, Mac, and settle the resolution.
And I said, Mr. President, there's some doubt as to what happened.
Yeah, never mind that.
All right, wait, I got to interrupt you here, Ray, and we got to go to this break again.
We're hearing about what Ray told Bush Sr., and we're about to hear what Bush Sr.said back right after this, y'all.
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All right, y'all, welcome back to the show.
Talking with the heroic Ray McGovern about his attempt to get George H.W. Bush to do something to stop his son from launching the aggressive war against Iraq in March 2003.
And he wrote this letter, and he brought up the crazies who you know who I'm talking about, Mr. President, Richard Perl and Paul Wolfowitz and their friends working for Dick Cheney, and brought up the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution and LBJ's bullying of the intelligence establishment and the cabinet to go along with his decision to have a war.
And then, so what did Bush Sr. say to you, Ray?
Okay.
First, I have to disavow being heroic, Scott.
Oh, please, give me a break.
No, stop talking about that and answer the question.
Just doing my job then, and I'm doing my job now.
I want to reassure you that I'm not engaged in a filibuster here.
What I need to do is set the stage for the response that I got from the former president, George H.W. Bush.
And let me just pick up where I was leaving off on the Gulf of Tonkin thing.
What McGeorge Bundy said to McNeil and Lehrer just stood my hair on end.
He said, well, you know, I said that the evidence was not so clear about whether there was an attack yesterday.
And the president just turned on me, and he's a big guy, you know, LBJ.
And he said, Matt, are you going up there on a hill to sell this resolution or are you not?
McNeil, what did you do?
Well, I went up the hill to sell the resolution.
Now, why do I say that?
Because there are people who, out of ideology, out of cowardice, out of careerism, I mean, McGeorge Bundy had been Dean at Harvard for God's sake.
He's not going to be out in the street.
So why did he do that?
I don't know why, but that's what we saw later when the intimidator was not the president, but the vice president, Dick Cheney.
Now, after Larry Wilkerson, chief of staff of Colin Powell during this whole thing, was asked by several congressmen at a formal hearing, how did this all go down?
How was it possible that the bureaucracy was completely escaped, that they completely overrid everything?
And Larry Wilkerson says, two words.
No, I'll say three words, the vice president.
Okay.
Now, no one was in a better position to know that.
In any case, I had written this thing up a week before I wrote this letter, and I enclosed a copy of this thing, which was titled, Drift Towards War Revives the Nightmare of the Tonkin Gulf in Vietnam.
And that leads me to the response I got from the senior Bush.
He says, Dear Ray, it is only meet and right that you speak out.
Wow.
Here I am, ranting and raving about this unnecessary war coming up, and I get it's meet and right that you speak up.
He says, thanks for your letter.
Please do not worry that, quote, crazies, end quote, have any influence on, on POTUS 43, which means President 43, Bush 43.
I will admit that early reporting indicated that, but it wasn't true then, and it's not true now.
Okay.
Well, that's what he said.
That's hopefully what he actually believed.
But there's no gainsaying the fact that as he watched things develop, he realized that Cheney and Rumsfeld, which he now admits, had inordinate pressure, inordinate influence on his son, if only because, you know, the young Bush styled himself, well, actually, he bragged about it several times.
I am the first war president of the 21st century.
Now, it doesn't take much to play on that instinct and get him to fashion an unnecessary war, especially when you have a guy like Cheney, who, you know, made detours all around the bureaucracy, leaned on my fellow analysts in the CIA to perjure themselves, okay, to concoct evidence.
And now, of course, Cheney is completely unrepentant.
He says a war was necessary, and besides torture, well, he didn't say torture, he said, or waterboarding, I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
And what is Bush, young Bush?
I mean, without a heartbeat, says that too.
And young Bush, you know, when his exit interview, you know, when he was still president, but just about to leave for the West, he was asked, did you have any regrets?
And he, you know, strokes his cheek and he said, well, yeah, it was that mistaken intelligence on Iraq.
Now, please, listeners, please know that that was the last and most grievous lie, that the intelligence was not mistaken.
It was fraud.
It was out and out fraud, and it pains me to this day that my former colleagues let themselves be suborned into concocting, into fabricating, into forging the kind of evidence that the president and vice president and secretary of defense used to, quote, justify this terrible war, which has had the incredible consequences that we predicted, actually, and that we now see without any taking pride in our prediction, all over the Middle East and not just in Iraq.
So, this was a cataclysmic thing.
And to have been, you know, at least, you know, I'm glad I tried.
I'm glad I tried at that time, because I wouldn't be able to live with my, I didn't try in Vietnam.
I saw some of the skullduggery that was going on in Vietnam.
I didn't have the courage to speak out then.
In other words, you know, what, one of the lessons here, Scott, is that there is no whistleblower protection for people in the intelligence community.
Now, I know five or 10 people still working there, who knew this was absolutely wrong, and didn't have the courage or didn't have the incentive or didn't, didn't feel they would be protected if they went to James Rison or someone like this and say, you know, this is a crock.
We're made, we're being made to fabricate intelligence.
So, that's really one of the lessons here.
There were, I would say, 100 people in my former analysis division of the CIA who knew exactly what was going to happen, and nobody spoke out.
Three Foreign Service officers, Anne Wright, Bradley Kiesling, and John H. Brown quit before the war because they could see from their perches in Mongolia and Greece and at Georgetown University how blatantly illegal and based on false pretenses it was.
Well, and there are a lot of generals that resigned too, but they retired.
They didn't make a stink about it and resign out of principle.
They just sort of finally, yeah.
Name one general like that.
That's my other beef here.
I mentioned General Zinni, okay?
Yeah.
Now, Zinni, you know, he's got a good rep.
Still, he has a good rep, but he was sitting there.
He was sitting there on August 26th, 2002, when Dick Cheney set the terms of reference for war.
Oh, and this is not just some general with a name that you never heard.
This is the head of Central Command.
This is the American commander of the Middle East.
Yeah, and as I say, he had a good rep up until then, and he was getting an award at the Veterans for Foreign Wars thing there in Nashville.
And so, he's sitting right next to Cheney.
And Cheney, of course, talked all about the weapons of mass destruction that Saddam Hussein had and that he was about to get a nuclear weapon and that don't be sucked into thinking that UN inspectors can help because that will just give you a false sense of security.
We know that Saddam is too clever.
He laid it all out there.
Had he told Colin Powell, the Secretary of State?
No.
Had he told George Tenet, the head of CIA?
No.
Where was George W. Bush?
Cleaning brush out there in Crawford, okay?
So, this was a preemptive move typical of Cheney, even though, you know, Andy Card later said, you don't market a new product in August.
Well, the hell with that, said Cheney.
And why did he say that?
Because George H. W. Bush's friends and cronies and statesmen like James Baker, who had his head screwed on, right?
Brent Scowcroft, National Security Advisor.
Hold it right there.
Hold it right there.
That's where we're going to pick up this conversation on the other side of the break, y'all.
It's Ray McGovern.
And this is a very important part of the story.
Cheney's VFW speech in August, and the preemption of the rest of Bush senior's men, as senior once thought Cheney was.
We'll be right back with Ray McGovern, just a sec, y'all.
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Okay, guys, we're talking with Ray McGovern, veteran intelligence professional for sanity, former CIA analyst, former morning briefer for vice president George H.W. Bush in the Reagan years, and we're talking about his correspondence with H.W. Bush in early 2003 in a last-ditch attempt to try to influence the president, to try to, the former president, to try to influence his son, the president, to put the brakes on and not start an aggressive war against Iraq.
And I think Brent Scowcroft's article, Don't Attack Saddam, that he wrote for the Wall Street Journal, is pretty famous, but I have to admit, I was kind of surprised.
I guess I remember Eagleburger's name floating around a little bit, but you really have, you memorized or wrote it down somewhere, all of George H.W. Bush's men who came out on a very obvious, deliberate campaign to speak for the father in August of 2002, but maybe they should have waited and debuted their product after Labor Day, like in Andrew Card's advice, because, as you say, Dick Cheney ran out and gave a speech and stomped him down, and that was the end of that, before Junior even got back from his vacation.
But so, anyway, please, even Henry Kissinger, Ray, tell the story.
Yeah, well, Scowcroft was a lead-off batter, August 4, Henry Kissinger, August 12.
Kissinger says, Unilateral attack will set dangerous precedent.
Then we have Scowcroft on the 15th saying, Don't attack Saddam.
On the 25th of August, we've got James Baker, okay?
Now, he has a long op-ed in the New York Times, and it was, of course, the next day that Cheney spoke out on the 26th in Nashville at the Veterans for Foreign Wars.
Chuck Hagel was complaining about the, you know, the stupidity of what was about to happen, and I think most interesting, Dick Ormey, who was the Republican majority leader in the House at the time, he complained later that the only reason he voted for the war was that he bitterly complained that he had been BS'd, the whole word there, by Cheney.
So, what Cheney needed to do was to stanch the juggernaut toward peace, and he successfully did that, with Bush out of town.
Five days later, Bush comes back, the die is cast, the propaganda offensive at the so-called White House Iraq group is full in sway with Karl Rove and Madeleine and all these people ready to, and sure enough, on the 8th of September, the big guns came out, with Tony Blair having been briefed the day before at Camp David, and that's when we got the aluminum tubes.
What did they do?
Wait, can I stop you for a second before the aluminum tubes, because I love this story, and I want to hear all this, everything from there to March, I want to hear it, but can I just mention the supreme cynicism of Dick Cheney to give this speech to the last veterans of World War II in Korea and Vietnam, and telling them, and even Desert Storm for that matter, and telling them they have to give up their grandsons and sons, great-grandsons, in many cases, to go fight this crusade, when this man Dick Cheney, above all of them, knew he was lying, right to their faces, this coward.
Yeah, I can't account for that, why he would do that, and of course, that's the big question.
Because you're questioning them, if you question their applause for him, basically, he's hiding behind them, in other words, just like Bush did with his constant, you know, pseudo-army jackets and soldiers draped behind him.
How can you criticize that?
He might as well be wearing an American flag suit.
Well, Scott, as you know better than most, the most important facet here, in my view, is the total cheerleading that the mainstream media was engaged in for war.
That's even more difficult for me to explain, but we lost our free media somewhere along the line, and there was no questioning of Dick Cheney, what he said, oh god, this was terrible, we have to go to war.
And so he had carte blanche to do this.
In fact, on the previous point there, Ray, about all of Senior's men, Scowcroft, Baker, Eagleburg, all these guys coming out, was there any break in the media at all at that time that said, wow, these men are clearly speaking for the father here?
I mean, obviously, Bush Senior is not going to write an op-ed against the war, but there's no way that these men are talking out of school like this unless Bush Senior called them and asked them to do it.
Well, you know, how do they handle that?
How do they handle that?
They're very clever.
They said, well, you know, it's not clear whether they're speaking for George H.W. Bush or not.
You know, do you think they are?
No.
Well, you think, well, maybe, in other words, they diverted the essence of the dispute into whether or not the father had approved this.
But the thing is, the answer is obvious, that absolutely, yes, he did order them to do it.
And that makes it even more important what they said, that this is the father telling his son that you're letting people manipulate you into doing the wrong thing, dummy.
Yeah.
But, you know, in a way, he should have said it himself.
And what he was saying is speak for yourself, George.
And they knew darn well, he wouldn't speak for himself.
He told me he was not going to say anything, you know, very cherry about going public with respect to his son.
So, you know, you're sort of asking him to do a Kaczynski here.
Remember him?
His brother gave him up, you know, Ted Kaczynski, the- Oh, Kaczynski, yeah, yeah.
The Unabomber.
Well, so, you know, is, you know, are we our brother's keeper?
Well, Ted Kaczynski's brother was.
How about, are we our son's keeper?
It was just beyond him, he couldn't do it.
And so, the press eluded it by making it into a big conversation.
Was he or wasn't he?
Was George Bush behind this or not?
And as you point out, hello, of course he was.
But getting back to Cheney and Zinni, and this is really painful to say.
So, Zinni's sitting right there.
He's going to get a blue ribbon or something, a new merit badge or something from the VFW, okay?
And he listens.
And later he says on Meet the Press, he says, you know, I couldn't believe this.
I was shocked to hear Cheney say this.
Why?
Because I was back on contract.
I was privy to all the intelligence on Iraq.
And what Cheney was saying was not squaring with anything I said.
Quote, there was no solid proof that Saddam had WMD.
I heard a case being made to go to war, period, end quote.
Guess when Zinni said that to Meet the Press?
Three and a half years later.
Now, you know, there are a lot of people who could have spoken out besides the people who wouldn't, the father.
You know, I've just been thinking Colin Powell knew damn well what was going on.
Yeah.
And he didn't speak out.
Jack Straw, his counterpart in the UK, the Attorney General of the UK, Lord Peter Goldsmith, who issued an opinion saying the war would be illegal just 10 days before the war.
For that matter, 150 million Americans who were against it before it started knew better, too.
Yeah, but they well, they kind of knew better, but they didn't have the evidence.
Another guy who I'd mentioned is James Clapper.
Now, what was he at the time?
He was head of imagery analysis.
In other words, all this satellite imagery, where would you expect to find WMD?
WMD in satellite photography.
So what was the word?
You know, when Chalabi, that fellow from the Iraqi Revolutionary Council was telling people, oh, there's a chemical weapons factory at these coordinates.
Go check it out.
And the imagery interpreter says, that's a crock.
That's a chicken coop.
Now, guess what?
Clapper's instructions were, don't report chicken coops.
If you can't report WMD, don't report anything.
And there was nothing to report.
It was all made up.
If there were satellite photos, Colin Powell would have showed them at the UN on the 5th of February.
So James Clapper sat on all this stuff after it went down and there were no WMD.
You know what he said?
Oh, I think they went to Syria.
Now, he was cashiered, right?
No.
He's the director of national intelligence, has been for a couple of years, lied under oath to Congress.
And he's still the director of national intelligence.
So, you know, for services performed, that's where you end up.
And that's how corrupt the intelligence setup now is.
And isn't that funny that we haven't heard anything from him about, see, Iraqi chemical weapons in Syria.
We found them when we're in the process of destroying the Syrian chemical weapons.
Nope, never happened.
Well, you know, I'm glad I don't have a shotgun.
These guys, man, well, they just get away with it.
That's for sure.
No, no, in the end, we're going to get them.
We're going to spread enough truth around Scott, you and I and others.
And we're going to make them face into this.
And this is the time to do it.
Because when Hillary voted for Iraq, she knew darn well what she was doing.
She wouldn't let Scott Ritter, the chief U.N. inspector into her office, even though he was a constituent, because she didn't want to hear there were no weapons of mass destruction.
Oh, yeah.
And remember, of course, our current vice president, Joe Biden, was the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee who held one or two bogus hearings of all warmongers and then shut the whole debate down and led the Democratic Senate vote for it.
He wouldn't let us in the door either.
Man.
All right, Ray, you're the best.
Thanks very much for coming back on the show, as always.
Most welcome.
All right, you guys.
Everybody go read Ray McGovern at Consortium News dot com.
Bush 41 finally speaks on the Iraq war.
See you all tomorrow.
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