06/30/15 – Philip Giraldi – The Scott Horton Show

Yeah, check it out.
Y'all want to win a free vacation to the jungles of Costa Rica this summer and help support the Scott Horton Show?
You can.
Joshua Hughes, peace activist and permaculturalist, runs Verde Energia Pacifica, an intentional community in the mountains of Llanes de Periscal, Costa Rica, and he's offered a raffle off a week's stay to listeners of this show.
Airfare is on you, but transportation to and from the airport, as well as a seven-day stay for you and a guest in your own private house with three meals a day is covered.
You can learn and practice some skills, or just go for a swim in the river, pool, or waterfall, walk jungle trails, enjoy the views, do yoga or dance in the studio, make art, play music, check out a local soccer game, or simply relax in a hammock by the river and read.
Raffle tickets are just $50.
Stop by scotthorton.org slash raffle for details, and anyone who enters will get half off on any future stay down there. scotthorton.org slash raffle.
Alright guys, welcome back.
I'm Scott Horton, it's my show, The Scott Horton Show, live from noon to 2 p.m.
Eastern Time here on Liberty Radio Network on the weekdays, archives at scotthorton.org.
First interview today is our friend Phil Giraldi from the Council for the National Interest, that's councilforthenationalinterest.org, former CIA and DIA officer, and writer for UNZ.com in the American Conservative magazine, and here he is at the UNZ Review, that's UNZ, UNZ.com, crunch time with Iran.
Let's push back against Israel's friends and avoid a war.
Well that sounds pretty good.
Welcome back to the show, how you doing Phil?
I'm fine Scott, how about you?
I'm doing good, appreciate you writing this and coming on the show.
So, you know, I just don't have the stomach to read Jennifer Rubin, I'm glad that you do, and she certainly is a great example and probably a great place to start this discussion.
You right here, well we can get to the talks too, but let's start with the propaganda push.
You really document thoroughly here, a very deep, I don't know, well-funded it sounds like, and maybe foreign push on the internet and all over the place, and of course in the neoconservative movement to scotch this Iran deal.
They're really doing everything they possibly can to build up, you know, opposition among whatever public or whatever interest groups that they possibly can get to.
Yeah, basically yeah.
The point of the article is that, you know, the outline for an agreement between the United States and the other five countries involved in negotiations in Iran have been there for like two years.
I mean everybody knows what it is.
It's Iran basically wants to be normalized and wants release from the sanctions, and the United States for its part wants Iran to have no course to obtain a nuclear weapon, and that basically should be verifiable.
It's as simple as that.
Now people are arguing now all kinds of things and saying, oh well, but what about Iran's support of terrorism?
What about the fact that Iran is destabilizing the Middle East?
Which is a funny thing coming from Americans.
But, you know, these kinds of arguments are being made because they don't really have a good argument, and the whole intention here is to make sure that this agreement does not go through, because Israel and its friends don't want it.
So the thing is that if you look at what's been happening, particularly over the last month, as this deadline has been approaching, there's just been an avalanche of negative information in the media and among politicians essentially saying, oh this is a bad deal.
And it's not a bad deal.
It's a good deal for everybody, including Israel.
Yeah, see that's the thing of it, and I'm sorry audience, because I know I'm just such a broken record.
I'm always quoting Stephen Walt about this, where he talks about how those of us who aren't afraid of Iran or their civilian, safeguarded nuclear electricity program are the ones who want this deal really bad.
And all the people who pretend to be terrified of those insane and unnegotiable Twelfth Imamists getting their hands on the H-bombs that'll kill us all in our jammies in the middle of the night, they don't want a deal.
They don't want to expand the inspections regime beyond all reason or precedent in the history of NPT or any of this kind of stuff.
They're determined to have a war under the excuse of a nuclear program that is, like we're already talking about, not a nuclear weapons program at all, and never was.
Yeah, I mean, the thing is, you know, when you consider what's going on, there's only one possible conclusion to come through, and that's essentially that Israel, acting against its own short-term interest, believe its longer-term interest is essentially to create a situation where the United States will attack and take out Iran.
And that's essentially what these guys want.
They want a war.
They figure, I think in a crazy way, that such a war would be containable, that it would be short, that it would be decisive, but you know, the history certainly in the last 15 years has taught us that that ain't the case.
Yeah.
Well, hey, let me ask you about the Saudi position on this for a minute, because of course there's a new king, and I don't know how much different that makes, or exactly what amount of control America has over the Saudi kingdom when it comes to these kinds of things.
Officially they've said, hey, yeah, we're for a deal.
Hey, you Americans, you're our friends, you know what you're doing, so we trust you.
But then apparently, no, they really don't mean that.
They're really pissed off about it.
But the facts of the case, I mean, because they're not neocon liars, I mean, maybe they have their agenda and their point of view or whatever, but they understand the simple truth that what we're talking about is a civilian program that is now going to be way scaled back and inspected further than ever before, safeguarded further than ever before, with less likelihood than ever before that it's actually going to be put to a nuclear weapon.
So maybe, you know, they're afraid of rapprochement between America and Iran once this nuclear issue is out of the way, but are they that upset, really?
Well, I think you hit the nail on the head.
They're not afraid of Iran as a nuclear power.
What they are afraid of is the rapprochement.
And they're also afraid of a normalized Iran, because Iran, relative to the region, is a major power.
And it has an industrial base, it has natural resources, it has a highly educated and creative population.
So the Saudis are more concerned about a challenge in their neighborhood from a regime that they dislike for religious reasons more than anything else.
And that's their concern.
I mean, you know, I think the nuclear issue has been kind of a phony issue for a long time.
And I think that the nuclear issue kind of is a convenient shorthand way of saying, we don't trust these guys, we don't want these guys.
But really, it masks a lot of other issues that these various constituencies in the Middle East are really concerned with.
Well, and I guess this nuclear deal really does amount to, or it could amount to a real turning point, a real change in America's policy of keeping Iran down and contained that we've had since 79.
And I know Bush got rid of Saddam for them in 2003 and fought a whole war for their guys.
But that was an accident, mostly because they're stupid, and listen to Ahmed Chalabi and that kind of thing.
But so, you know, that's not really an aberration in the policy as much as just, you know, kind of a mistake, but the policy has stayed the same.
And, and do you think that this if they get this nuclear deal, and especially, I guess, considering that we have a new president coming in a pretty predictable one, probably, I think, do you think that this even could amount to a real change in America's policy toward the, you know, Mullah's regime or whatever the hell it's called?
Well, you know, a lot depends on how the other situation, which is the situation in Iraq and Syria plays out.
Because Iran is a major asset for the United States in terms of a counterweight to ISIS.
And it's also a major counterweight in terms of creating a stable situation in terms of Iraq and Syria, which are friendly to Iran, and in a sense, are almost client states.
So there are a lot of US interests that actually merge with Iranian interests.
And I would not be surprised if we had a president who wasn't tied hand and foot by various interests.
To see the light on that, I think, back a few months ago was even, you know, there were even rumors going around that the United States was was thinking of, of working together with Iran.
And in fact, there were some indications that they were doing just that.
So I think there's there was a definite community of interest.
Yeah, I mean, never mind, principled libertarianism or non intervention or anything, but just there, you know, from the accepting the argument of the empire itself and its existence, there's still a lot of damn daylight here filled between the American and the Israeli interest in the Middle East, where, as you say, in what makes sense at all from the American side, if we have to be in again, accepting all these premises of intervention, we're on the Shiite side, or they're on our side.
And here we are allied with all the Sunnis who are our enemies and backing our enemies.
Yeah, that's the irony of it, isn't it?
I mean, it's in common sense would tell you, in fact, I just, I have a piece that will be appearing later this week at the American conservative on the new State Department report on on terrorism on international terrorism, which covers the year 2014.
And I make the comment, I said, there's something wrong here, because the report is claiming that ISIS is the major emerging terrorist threat for the whole world.
And yet we are doing everything we can to oppose the countries that are frontline states opposing ISIS, which would be Iran, and Syria.
And so you know, the whole the whole policy is screwed up.
All right, hold it right there.
It's Phil Giraldi, everybody.
He's at the Council for the National Interest, and at UNS.com.
We'll be right back.
Hey, y'all.
Scott Horton here for Liberty.me, the social network and community based publishing platform for the liberty minded.
Liberty.me combines the best of social media technology all in one place and features classes, discussions, guides, events, publishing, podcasts, and so much more.
And Jeffrey Tucker and I are starting a new monthly show at Liberty.me, Eye on the Empire.
It's just four bucks a month if you use promo code Scott when you sign up.
And hey, once you do, add me as a friend on there at Scott Horton dot Liberty.me.
Be free.
Liberty.me.
All right, you guys, welcome back.
I'm Scott Horton.
This is my show, the Scott Horton Show.
So I'm talking to Phil Giraldi, and as usual, the discussion has gone way off course to the fact that America and its allies are backing our enemies in the war in Syria.
And by the way, Phil, I have to just work this in here.
I had totally missed this.
This is at the Council on Foreign Relations Journal Foreign Affairs from their March issue accepting al-Qaeda, the enemy of the United States enemy.
And of course, Assad is our enemy because Israel says so.
And I guess because Turkey says so and Saudi says so.
But anyway, I mean, I know that we all know and we've covered on the show, there's been this attempt to rehabilitate al-Qaeda in Syria as the moderate ISIS since the mythical moderates have, you know, whatever did exist of them is are is basically gone now.
So now the al-Qaeda guys in this Syria war are the moderates and they're working really hard.
They're working really hard at it when they're going to make this a headline in foreign affairs where, you know, it's the same story with them all the time, backing monsters and then recommending the backing of monsters and then recommending wars against them and then recommending the backing of those same monsters again and over and over for the last century almost now.
But anyway, so that's all to say that's the tangent we got off on.
And maybe we can get back to that because I actually have some more questions to ask about that.
But really, I want to talk about this article and what's in it because it's really important.
We're right at the deadline.
They've extended the deadline for a few more days, but we're trying to get this Iran nuclear deal through.
You've got the entire lobby and all of their allies literally, as you document in here, doing everything they possibly can, including spamming the comments sections all over the internet and every other thing they can possibly do to scotch this thing.
And then on the other side, you have the president who seems to have staked a lot on this and he sure seems to have the attitude that he wants to see this through.
Do you think they can stop him?
Yeah, I think they can stop him.
I think that what we've seen certainly over the last couple weeks shows that there's actually an intensity of activity attacking.
The line now is, of course, that we want a deal.
Everybody's saying, yeah, we want a deal, but we want a good deal.
And essentially that is a lie because they don't want a good deal.
They want no deal.
And they can stop him.
It depends on whether Obama feels confident that he has enough support within his own party, that's the key to this, to avoid having this defeated in Congress after he agrees to it.
So I think that's what it comes down to.
He's counting the numbers.
And I think he probably will not go through with it if he thinks he's going to be, if he's fairly confident he'll be defeated in Congress.
So yeah, they can do it.
But I'm mildly optimistic.
I think Obama will stick by his guns.
And I think he realizes that this is the right thing to do.
And I think we will see this.
That doesn't mean the struggle will stop then, but it'll enter a different phase.
But hopefully we'll see this get done within a week.
Yeah, man.
Well, and you know, once they have it done, then the politics really should shift in his favor strongly.
Where now, I got this deal.
I've determined it's in our national interest.
And I'm our commander in chief and all that nonsense.
And so are you really going to screw this up?
That's a different frame of events from, or of events than, you know, the way it is now.
So I sure hope, I mean, I'm mildly optimistic too.
I, you know, seems like he told Kerry, yeah, let's do this thing.
And, you know, as you reported back a year or two years ago now, I forget that they already worked, I think a year ago, they already worked all the details here out in, no, it was two years ago, right?
Before the, the fall of 2013 deal.
They already worked out all the details in their secret talks in Amman, according to your sources.
Yeah, that's right.
They basically, the details of this have been worked out for a long time.
What's going on now is it's kind of the fine tuning where everybody thought they had a basic understanding of what's going on.
But the fine tuning is being interfered with by US politics.
There's no other way to put it.
And that's, that's essentially what the impediment has been.
I think everybody else, the, you know, the other five nations that are involved in this are on board.
Okay.
So, um, uh, let me ask you this, uh, what to do about it.
You, uh, have a great little, uh, write up in your UNS column about what the American people can do to, uh, help try to shift the balance of power here in America on this issue.
Yeah, basically, uh, I'm taking the principle of the BDS movement, the boycott, divestment, and sanction movement, uh, which, uh, is a Palestinian cause and say, we need that here.
Uh, there are a number of, uh, of billionaires, uh, who are strong supporters of Benjamin Netanyahu and his policies and have basically created this situation.
They've enabled the situation where this resistance to a policy by the White House is, is being mounted.
And I said, let's identify them and let's do a boycott.
And I'm not talking about an organized boycott, but I was talking about us as individuals.
Uh, you know, we don't have to go and stay at the Venetian in Las Vegas because that's Sheldon Adelson's hotel.
We don't have to go and see a movie where our non-milch on is, is the producer.
Uh, you know, there are, there are ways that we can take money away from these people and, and show our dissatisfaction with the, with the policies that they're pushing.
And, and, uh, I think, uh, I think that's a reasonable idea.
And I think if it, it's something that might even catch on among people who are, are very unhappy about, uh, the warfare state that we seem to be, uh, be involved in.
Yeah.
Hey, how about an organized one?
All we need is an acronym that rhymes with BDS, but it's a little bit different, you know, and then the two go together.
Yeah, we could do that.
If you come up with something, tell me.
Yeah.
Uh, well, somebody come up with something.
I don't know.
Give me a minute to think about it when I'm not live on the air and maybe I'll, maybe I'll be able to.
Um, but yeah, no, I think that's a great idea.
And it's actually, uh, you know, I know that you're a regular reader of Mondo Weiss like myself.
We're, you're talking about a handful of guys here, very few, uh, businessmen, uh, who just put their fortune on the side of the Israeli right as much as they possibly can.
And they're pretty easy to identify and boycott.
I mean, that, that should be doable.
Why not?
Yeah, that's right.
I mean, I, I name a number of them in my article.
I mean, there's Robert Kraft, the owner of the, uh, New England Patriots.
Uh, there's also, of course, uh, uh, Adelson, there's, uh, Haim Saban, there is, uh, um, uh, Milchan, uh, you know, Singer.
Is it Paul Singer?
Yeah.
Singer would be another one.
Sure.
No, no question about it.
And I was thinking the Seagram family, uh, the Bronfman family, which owns, owns Seagram in Canada, uh, major supporters of, of right wing Israel, but apparently they've sold their business address.
So it wouldn't make any sense to boycott them.
Yeah.
Um, all right.
Well, yeah, I mean, there's a good list to start right there.
Um, and you know what?
I was just talking with Annie Robbins from Mondo Weiss the other day about the BDS and the numbers and what's happening now is it's not just the hurt of the withholding of the money, but it's just the bad PR for being on the wrong side of the line where now businesses that don't give a damn either way are looking at it purely from a bottom line point of view, the boycott is working and it's, uh, it's, um, kind of snowball rolling downhill kind of thing, you know?
That's right.
Yeah, that's right.
Uh, so it's becoming more and more powerful as it becomes more and more powerful on a parabola sort of a deal is what I'm trying to say.
So anyway, great.
Um, yeah, man, great idea.
I think we should do it.
Uh, and great article.
Crunch time with Iran.
It's at the unsreview uns.com.
Thanks, Phil.
Appreciate it.
Okay, Scott.
All right.
Hey, I'll Scott Horton here for the future of freedom.
The monthly journal of the future freedom foundation at F F F dot org slash subscribe.
Since 1989 F F F has been pushing an uncompromising moral and economic case for peace, individual liberty and free markets.
Sign up now for the future freedom featuring founder and president Jacob Hornberger as well as Sheldon Richmond, James Bovard, Anthony Gregory, Wendy McIlroy and many more.
It's just $25 a year for the print edition, 15 per year to read it online.
That's F F F dot org slash subscribe and tell him Scott sent you phone records, financial and location data, prism, tempura, X key score, boundless informant.
Hey, I'll Scott Horton here for off now dot org.
Now here's the deal.
Do the Snowden revelations.
We have a great opportunity for a short period of time to get some real rollback of the national surveillance state.
Now they're already trying to tire us by introducing fake reforms in the Congress and the courts.
They betray their sworn oaths to the Constitution and Bill of Rights again and again and can in no way be trusted to stop the abuses for us.
We've got to do it ourselves.
How we nullify it at the state level.
It's still not easy.
The off now project of the 10th Amendment Center has gotten off to a great start.
I mean it.
There's real reason to be optimistic here.
They've gotten their model legislation introduced all over the place in state after state.
I've lost count more than a dozen.
You're always wondering, yeah, but what can we do?
Here's something, something important, something that can work if we do the work.
Get started cutting off the NSA support in your state.
Go to off now dot org.
Hey, I'll guess what?
You can now order transcripts of any interview I've done for the incredibly reasonable price of two and a half bucks each.
Listen, finding a good transcriptionist is near impossible, but I've got one now.
Just go to scotthorton.org slash transcripts.
Enter the name and date of the interview you want written up.
Click the PayPal button and I'll have it in your email in 72 hours max.
You don't need a PayPal account to do this.
Man, I'm really gonna have to learn how to talk more good.
That's scotthorton.org slash transcripts.